I'd say "Out of line, Scape"...

Subject: I'd say "Out of line, Scape"...
Author: Sergio Turbo
Posted on: 2016-01-25 23:10:00 UTC

... but, despite being nowhere near a violent person myself, if I was there I would've punched that person straight in the face. So calling you out on that would be hypocrisy.

My sympathies, Ix. I... Well, I had it much better than you, probably, but in the past stuff happened that makes me understand how you feel.

... Is there the Internet equivalent of an hug? 'Cause I want to offer you one.

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OT Rant: Dear Able-Bodied People... by Iximaz on 2016-01-25 16:51:00 UTC Reply

Yes. I know. I've heard it before. I'm too young to be in a wheelchair. I'm lazy. I'm seeking attention. I'm faking.

If I have the gall to so much as stand up from my chair because I feel like, for ten seconds, my back will be able to stand bearing my weight, well, shame on me for not falling perfectly into your black-and-white scale of disability. If I can stand, I must not need a chair and am therefore faking. If I'm not totally paralyzed from the waist down, I must not need a chair and am therefore faking.

Just because I can move my legs and don't have an obviously broken bone (the only other acceptable time to use a chair, don't you know?) doesn't mean I am able to walk. Just because there isn't something visibly wrong with me doesn't make it okay for you to interrogate me on the extent of my medical problems. That is between me, my doctors, and whichever friends and family members I decide to share with. You, a random stranger, have no right to come up to me and demand to know why I'm in a wheelchair. And you especially have no right to accuse me of faking a disability because you saw me limp three steps from my chair to a different, more comfortable chair. There is a reason why I made sure the distance was that short.

If I'm in so much pain that I need a chair to get around, the last thing I want and need is to have a stranger getting up in my face over something that is none of their business.

The problem is perpetuated by thinking that either you're disabled, or you're not. Either you can walk, or you can not. Disability is not an either-or situation. For the most part, I am able to walk. I am able to run. I can jump rope, ride horses, play tag. But sometimes, I am able to do none of these things, because my back hurts so badly I can barely lift my head from my pillow. Sometimes, I am able to sit up, but only with assistance. Sometimes I am able to sit up fine but can't walk without excruciating pain shooting through my spine and hip. If I was able to walk, believe me, I would be walking.

Just because you see me standing out of my chair does not mean you've seen a miracle. You've just seen a girl who wants to reach something and thinks she might be able to make it. If you see me struggling to stand because I need to reach something, offer your assistance. Do not, however, mock me, jeer at me, or accuse me of being lazy, or seeking attention, and especially not faking. (Don't insist on helping if I decline, either, but that's a rant for another day.)

Yours,

Someone who wants this ableism to stop.

I really wish I knew what to say by Mister Shoebox on 2016-01-27 05:36:00 UTC Reply

Anything I'd say would sound condescending, as I can't even begin to imagine what you're going through or how much people can be insensitive dicks.

Only thing I CAN say is "I'm sorry people can be jerks."
Also, architects? by Iximaz on 2016-01-26 21:38:00 UTC Reply

If your elevator is behind a very heavy pair of double doors that can only be manually opened, you're doing it wrong.

Access FAIL. by Calista on 2016-01-27 14:44:00 UTC Reply

Notice the fluorescent lighting, too. Ugh. I HATE tube fluorescents; they're like an electrified headache with their buzzing and flickering. I know incandescent bulbs are expensive and burn out fast, so could we at least compromise on CFLs?

One other thing I see routinely in my area is this: The apartment manager neatly clears the sidewalk of snow in the winter. They do not, however, clear the curb cuts. So you get this nice clear sidewalk, and then a mountain of snow right next to the road. I mean, WTF?! I've seen more than one guy in a wheelchair in the road, because the sidewalks are unusable because the curb cuts are not cleared. And it's not like wheelchairs are unusual around here; we're right next to a university that's well-known for its ability to accommodate disabled students and thus for its large disabled student population. But no.

But no. Apparently it's perfectly fine to force wheelchair users into the road, even though since they're seated they have an even higher risk of being involved in a traffic accident than someone who's standing does.
But the checklist doesn't say that! by Huinesoron on 2016-01-27 07:48:00 UTC Reply

-Are there ramps in front of all the doors (even if you have to climb on the railing to open those doors)?

-Are there ~~lifts~~ elevators to every floor (even if getting to all of them requires a handy princess and a very long piece of string)?

-Are there handrails on all the stairs (including that two-step one you had to put in to get over a pipe, but not including the various ladders)?

-Are all emergency exits clearly signposted (including the one behind the bookshelf and the one that's really a skylight)?

Etc. Actually thinking about the reason for your checklist takes wooooooork.

Seriously, this whole thing sounds rubbish. Have you considered adding rocket engines to the chair? (I know, I know, I say that about everything...)

hS, who actually wrote about 'emergency lightning' in point 4 but had to retract it due to being too awesome

Nah, you know what we need? Not rocket boosters... by Iximaz on 2016-01-27 13:18:00 UTC Reply

Something like this.

Because who doesn't want a levitating wheelchair that can fly right over obstacles? Seriously, just look at that sucker!

Though that would bring in another host of problems like trying to get through doorways that are already too narrow in the first place...

Chairs? by Larfen J. Stocke, esq on 2016-01-28 05:16:00 UTC Reply

One day, in the 26th century, archaeologists will look at our modern wheelchairs and think 'How quaint.'
I present: THE FUTURE.
http://www.livescience.com/47353-robot-exosuit-helps-paralyzed-move.html
Or, how about:
http://news.vanderbilt.edu/2012/10/exoskeleton/?utmsource=vuhomepage&utmmedium=newsbox&utm_campaign=exoskeleton
Not enough Brain-Computer Interfacing, eh? How about:
http://www.slashgear.com/mindwalker-brain-controlled-exoskeleton-puts-the-paralyzed-on-their-feet-04284889/

It's not the future yet, but you can probably see it if you squint a little.
Sorry, but anything can be made better with more boosters. (nm) by domirossi on 2016-01-27 17:55:00 UTC Reply

For clarity: by Huinesoron on 2016-01-27 21:04:00 UTC Reply

Wheelchair.

VASTLY BETTER wheelchair.

hS

It still misses important parts... by Hardric on 2016-01-27 21:09:00 UTC Reply

Where do you fit the heavy machineguns and rocket launchers?

Professor X vs. the narrow doorway by Calista on 2016-01-27 14:47:00 UTC Reply

If you made your doorways too narrow for Professor X's wheelchair to get through, he would just telekinetically widen it. About a foot or so of wall on either side of that door would go flying, and then he'd come through like a tank through battlefield smoke, and you wouldn't dare to cross him because, you know, powerful mutant dude. Besides, he's just helping you remodel your building to be more accessible!

But Professor X isn't telekinetic... just telepathic. (nm) by Iximaz on 2016-01-27 16:13:00 UTC Reply

...I blame mornings. by Calista on 2016-01-27 17:54:00 UTC Reply

Yup. Just too early to remember which powers belong to which X-man. When a person's confusing Professor X and Jean Grey, you know they need coffee!

Maybe telepathic is better for the purpose anyhow. He could force the building's owner to feel the simulated frustration of every visitor who's ever tried to get through that narrow doorway.

I would say you could attach it to a hoverboard... by Huinesoron on 2016-01-27 13:24:00 UTC Reply

... but a) that word doesn't mean what I think it means and b) it would catch fire.

hS

I am so sorry to hear about that kind of people by EileenAlphabet on 2016-01-26 12:50:00 UTC Reply

I have a friend myself who uses a wheelchair, but not all the time, so I'm fully aware that it's a thing. But I'd like to flatter myself that even if I didn't have said friend, I would have the brainpower to figure out that if I saw someone get up from their wheelchair, then it means that they don't need it all the time, not that they don't need it at all.

People like that are just a--holes and you're absolutely right: They have no right to question you and throw accusations at you. If they're truly interested in expanding their mind they can go home and google or ask a doctor the next time they meet one.
And I'm really sorry that you have to deal with that kind of crap on top of having a medical condition.

*hugs* (Or a *highfive* if you're not a huggy person.)
Cor by Larfen J. Stocke, esq on 2016-01-26 04:25:00 UTC Reply

I never see these people in real life, but I always hear about them. People who are just complete, through and through dicks. I wonder where they go, where they hide.
Is there a meeting place of some sort? Some rarely visited thread in the middle of the internet wasteland where people talk about other human beings the same way the Avengers talk about Hydra?
I like to think that I'm pretty good at empathising with others, but these people are complete enigmas to me.
How misanthropic does someone have to be to instantly assume that someone is up to no good for standing out of a wheelchair? Surely there are other conclusions to come to?
Or are these people desperate to be Batman - ready to jump at any assumed criminal activity and bask in that feeling of 'There's someone I'm objectively better than!'

I don't know.
You deserve better than this. Cor, blimey.
Urgh. How annoying. by Calista on 2016-01-26 01:18:00 UTC Reply

Some people don't like thinking very much, do they? I mean, it should be obvious that there are things in between "Completely unable to walk, ever" and "Can walk as far as I like without pain", and that, at some point, a wheelchair is far more convenient, fast, and comfortable. But most people are clueless, not because they can't understand, but because they don't bother to think about it.

I don't have a physical disability, but I do have autism and recurrent depression, and I get the same crap in a different way. Every time I manage something that's difficult for me--say for example attending a social gathering without losing my words, shutting down, or bolting out of there--everybody expects me to be able to do that *all the time*. It doesn't matter if that was a good brain day and I'm going to pay for it by having to take it easy for at least 24 hours thereafter; people just assume that hey, if I did it once, I should be able to do it whenever I like.

Every time you have a good day and people see you can do something, they hold it against you.

It's frustrating, yeah. by Iximaz on 2016-01-26 01:58:00 UTC Reply

I wish I had a nickel for every time someone felt the need to comment on the fact that I was walking just fine last week. Could have paid off my college tuition right there.

"But most people are clueless, not because they can't understand, but because they don't bother to think about it."

This. This right here. This so much. This is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about, why I posted my rant. And don't get me started on the other assumptions people like to make about you...

*offers hugs* Social gatherings aren't easy for me, either. I'm always having to scout out the nearest exit because I'm always thinking I'm going to have to make a break for it. It sucks, but... it's either that or lose your friends because you stayed at home again.

All we can really do is our best to make people understand.

Okay, then (nm) by Dark Brother 16 on 2016-01-25 23:22:00 UTC Reply
That, honestly, kinda scared me... by Matt Cipher on 2016-01-25 20:51:00 UTC Reply

My first thought was 'Did anyone on Board said something that sparked this?', but after we've learned that it was because of college I can agree that humans, more often than not, are d-bags. Yes, I include myself in that, but that's beside the point.

After an accident, sometimes my left ankle refuses to work. The pain usually lasts couple of hours, then subsides, but couple of months ago it was so bad I couldn't stand up from my chair. I panicked. For the rest of the day, I had to use a makeshift cane to move around. This usually doesn't prevent me from doing activities (I used to train capoeira; it was fun, but right now it's out of the question), but sometimes it does. This, and the fact that I look like the Fat Bastard from Austin Powers, made people think that it's okay to tell me to exercise more and more, and that I'm lazy and ambition-less... Even if I know all of that, and it doesn't come easy for me, it doesn't matter because apparently I'm not even trying to do anything about myself. So yeah, I kinda get what you're feeling, Ix.
Who did that to you? by Cattomboy/Jeboy on 2016-01-25 20:33:00 UTC Reply

i swear to gosh darn hell people like that piss me off. Just like that one woman who posed in a wheelchair for a photo fashion shoot because she thinks being trans is the same thing as being in a wheelchair.

Dude, language. by Iximaz on 2016-01-25 20:39:00 UTC Reply

And enough people for me to realize this is a recurring thing and needs to be addressed. Mostly it's students who give me the dismissal because they're the ones I interact with the most, but adults can be pretty judgemental too. I had some lady at a convention yell at me for taking away chairs from the people who needed them. :/

So yeah. Think before you speak. You don't know why they're in a chair so you have no right to judge them for it.

oops sorry by Cattomboy/jebboy on 2016-01-26 19:32:00 UTC Reply

Forgot to get rid of the swearing there.

Ducking Heck. by Hardric on 2016-01-25 17:01:00 UTC Reply

What happened? Is it really serious? (well, obviously it is, but...) Any chance for you to defintively get out of a wheelchair someday?

Hardic, freaking worried right now.

Nah, just... by Iximaz on 2016-01-25 17:09:00 UTC Reply

I've got a disease where the discs in my back are slowly deteriorating and sometimes that causes nerves to get pinched and the bones to grind in places where they shouldn't be grinding. Apparently it's supposed to get better as I age and my back gets used to the abuse. :/

But it's very frustrating to get all the "oh, but you were walking just fine yesterday!" comments when the first flare-up of the year happens and you have to switch to the chair. Even more frustrating is after you stop using the chair and you start getting accusatory looks from your classmates.

It's something that comes and goes and you can't really prepare for when it happens other than to have a doctor on speed-dial so they can get you pain meds, and after that it's a few months' worth of physical therapy to get things to a (mostly) pain-free state.

It sucks, but it's not life-threatening.

(And I don't mind sharing what happened, but like I said in my rant, it's generally impolite to ask. Just so's you knows.)

Wow. by son_of_heaven176 on 2016-01-26 02:32:00 UTC Reply

I did not know that such a condition even existed. Thank you for being brave enough to educate us on what's going on; sometimes ignorance is not bliss.

But ignorant of your condition or not, that guy who pulled the wheelchair away from you? Not Cool at all. My mother is a home health aide, and I've seen that sometimes people who use wheelchairs to get around are nonetheless able to walk short distances; this does not mean that they don't need the wheelchair.
So... by Neshomeh on 2016-01-25 18:41:00 UTC Reply

I'm confused. Is this rant one of those things where you just needed to get something off your chest but don't actually want to talk about it, or is it okay to ask what prompted the rant, or what? If you don't mind talking about it but it's impolite to ask, what is the correct way for a person with no particular distinguishing personal status to express concern and, dare I admit it, curiosity about a friend's distinguishing personal status? I don't want to give offense, but I don't want to pretend things aren't happening and don't make me concerned and curious to learn about them, either.

~Neshomeh

Mostly because I want people to be aware. by Iximaz on 2016-01-25 19:46:00 UTC Reply

I've been in and out of a wheelchair for about two years now, and it's very rare for me to find someone who realizes it's not an all-or-nothing situation.

What prompted the rant was realizing I'd have to use the chair again, and I wasn't looking forward to the usual treatment: "Oh no, what happened?" shortly followed by "Wait, if you can walk, why are you using that?"

It... ended up being worse today. I got out of my chair to reach the water fountain, only to have someone pull the damn thing away and say I didn't "really" need it, so I could come and get it.

As for when it's fine to ask... general rule of thumb is if the disabled person initiated the topic, they're inviting themselves for questions.

But yeah, I want people to realize that not everyone who uses a wheelchair is paralyzed, and you shouldn't judge them if they're not. It's not something you really realize until you're put on the receiving end of things, whether personally or through a family member or friend.

I've seen a similar story. by Voyd on 2016-01-26 15:03:00 UTC Reply

It pisses me off just as much now.
God, what a dickhead. by eatpraylove on 2016-01-25 22:51:00 UTC Reply

I'm really sorry for what you're going through. I wish I had non-cliche advice or support to give you, but as an able-bodied person I literally have no idea what you need to hear.

Instead, here's an accordion cover of the Goldenrod City/Johto Bicycle theme to make you smile. Hopefully this will help.
Oh my gosh, are you serious? by Fasoula on 2016-01-25 21:49:00 UTC Reply

Someone actually did that? ... Bwuh?

I cannot for the life of me fathom how person justifies pulling a wheelchair from someone clearly using it. I know people can be jerks, but I had always imagined they grew out of such juvenile, callous behavior after realizing in middle school that other people actually have feelings too.
Since he cannot go beyond the obvious... by Hardric on 2016-01-25 20:15:00 UTC Reply

I suggest getting him Nora's answer to any ills in the world. Breaking his legs. We'll see if that's so fun for him once he "really" needs his own wheelchair.
Okay, wow. by Neshomeh on 2016-01-25 20:10:00 UTC Reply

That person was something I can't say on the Board and keep to its PG-13 rating. Good grief. I'm sorry people are jerks.

Pain is definitely one of those things that people without it struggle to understand (assuming they're even trying, of course). That and mental health issues. We can't see them, they doesn't seem to follow any predictable rules, they wax and wane and yet they're always a looming presence.

... Maybe you can get a sign that says "I have [name of thing], look it up" to use on these occasions? {= P

~Neshomeh

But that would be asking people to use their brain. by Iximaz on 2016-01-25 23:53:00 UTC Reply

And you know we can't have that. :/
I'm speechless. No words can express what I think. (nm) by DCCCV on 2016-01-25 22:41:00 UTC Reply

I'm so very sorry. by DCCCV on 2016-01-27 00:59:00 UTC Reply

I can't help but think of this scene. Not sure if it's appropriate or relevant, but this may help.

I would suggest getting it painted... by Scapegrace on 2016-01-25 22:26:00 UTC Reply

On the business end of a lump hammer.

Yeah, I know I have anger issues, but I think this time my anger is entirely justified. This is a disgusting way to treat people and particularly educated people at universities should bloody know better. I am sickened by this behaviour.

If I could suggest a non-violent option? Take a photo of people who do similar stuff. Detail what they do. Post it online. Names if you have it, not if you don't. You deserve better than this and for two pins I'd find whoever did this and make them wish I'd never been born.

I'd say "Out of line, Scape"... by Sergio Turbo on 2016-01-25 23:10:00 UTC Reply

... but, despite being nowhere near a violent person myself, if I was there I would've punched that person straight in the face. So calling you out on that would be hypocrisy.

My sympathies, Ix. I... Well, I had it much better than you, probably, but in the past stuff happened that makes me understand how you feel.

... Is there the Internet equivalent of an hug? 'Cause I want to offer you one.

Nah, I'm with Scape on that one. by Matt Cipher on 2016-01-25 23:25:00 UTC Reply

I consider myself a person that gets angry very rarely, but if something like this happened around me, somebody would be eating their own teeth.

Same thing goes for me as well. (nm) by James Shields on 2016-01-26 01:40:00 UTC Reply
Agreed. (nm) by SkarmorySilver on 2016-01-26 01:07:00 UTC Reply
Ditto (nm) by Mattman The Comet on 2016-01-25 23:46:00 UTC Reply

I do believe the internet equivalent of a hug... by Mattman The Comet on 2016-01-25 23:22:00 UTC Reply

...Is a barrage of Cute Kittens

Sorry about this, the rant get me really worried. (nm) by Hardric on 2016-01-25 17:12:00 UTC Reply