Subject: /low whistle/ That's SOME digging!
Author:
Posted on: 2018-07-19 15:28:00 UTC
I can appreciate it, mind, since I'm an Archive Binger myself. |D
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Erroneous charges? (Also, hello again!) by
on 2018-07-19 13:47:00 UTC
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So, I recently dove back into the PPC (by the way, Hello again! My previous incarnation was Anonymouse, and before that, ThePoketrix, but it's been YEARS since I've been on here, so long that I can't even find my old posts in the Search anymore... and I also go by yet another different name here on the Internet nowadays, hence the second name change), and was reading a mission involving the Fallout continuum, (specifically, Journey Down a Long Road, by ShatteredSanity, covering the eponymous badfic by C.Stewart which... doesn't exactly exist anymore... when I noticed that the agents in the fic were incorrect in the charges they gave.
Specifically, the badfic mentions that the Sue had, quote, "a silver .45 automatic pistol with a snakeskin handle." The agents seem to have erroneously mixed up the .45 Auto pistol (a weapon based on the Colt 1911, added by the DLC Honest Hearts) with the .44 Magnum revolver, judging from the line, "Secondly, where did the Stu get a .44 , which are rare enough on their own, with a snakeskin handle?", which seem to have masked the actual charge here.
There is a .45 Auto pistol with a snakeskin handle in the game. It is the unique weapon A Light Shining in Darkness, owned by Joshua Graham (and, should the Courier complete Honest Hearts, owned by the Courier). However, A Light Shining in Darkness is not made of silver- it is made out of the same sort of metal that normal .45 Auto pistols are made of, which is presumably normal steel. (The actual special thing about A Light Shining in Darkness's appearance, besides the snakeskin grip, along with minute details like the skeletonized hammer and trigger, shorter barrel, trench sights, et cetera, is that it has a quote from the Bible- "And the light shineth in darkness, and the darkness comprehended it not,"- engraved in Greek on its sides.)
The charge shouldn't be simply "Having a gun with a snakeskin handle," since that isn't a charge in the Fallout universe, because A Light Shining in Darkness exists. The charges should be "Having in your possession A Light Shining in Darkness, which is a unique weapon owned by Joshua Graham and/or the Courier. Transmuting the metal that A Light Shining in Darkness is made of from steel to silver."
In addition, another of the charges against him is "Having a bullet-proof vest." While one of the traders at the 188 Trading Post does mention that the NCR used to give bulletproof vests to its soldiers, what makes me raise an eyebrow is that there is an instance of an actual, SWAT-style bulletproof vest existing in the game, that can be acquired by the courier. It exists as part of... wait for it... Joshua Graham's armor, obtained alongside A Light Shining in Darkness. So again, the charge should be "Having in your possession a unique piece of armor. Tearing apart said unique piece of armor to wear only part of it," instead of merely "Having a bullet-proof vest."
By the way, if it wasn't obvious by my paragraphs-long rant about how a badfic that was killed years ago actually deserved a few charges that are worse than what it actually got, I'm a bit of a Fallout fan (enough to get very, very irked about how much people praise that one mod that adds holorifles to Fallout 4 for being lore-friendly. In the name of Arceus's well-lit tailpipe, no, it is not lore-friendly, the Holorifle is a unique weapon and all copies of it should either be in the Sierra Madre or in the possession of the Courier!). I'm also really into Pokemon, MLP, Terraria, Harry Potter, and quite a few other things. Also, I'm a bit of an RPer, so... yeah. Hello again. -
A quick question that I only now thought of. by
on 2018-07-20 15:57:00 UTC
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For the Pokemon-style exorcism (which uses a piece of canon as a Silph Scope to reveal where you're supposed to aim, and either smoke bombs or thrown Sue-Wraiths to knock out the Sue-Wraith), why are smoke bombs used?
I get the projectile Sue-Wraiths, they're explained as "Ghost-type attacks" and yeah, you're literally attacking a ghost with another ghost, but the smoke bombs are supposed to be... Dark-type? Except Smokescreen (the closest analogous move to a smoke bomb) is a Normal-type move, not a Dark-type move, and it's mainly associated with Fire- and Poison-type Pokemon. The only Dark-types who get Smokescreen as a move are the Greninja line (who get it because ninja) and Spiritomb (who only gets it through breeding).
I personally would suggest a silenced firearm (doesn't matter what type, although you probably want a pistol, not a rifle, for range concerns) instead- the Dark-type are known for sneaking, backstabbing, and striking from the shadows, and an unexpected silenced pistol round in the back of the wraith's head could be viewed as the move Sucker Punch (whose Japanese name translates to "Surprise Attack"). Alternatively, one could instead just capture the spirit when its back is turned without an opening shot, and charge the Wraith while it's in the jar- which again, could be considered such Dark-type moves as Thief, Sucker Punch, or Knock Off.
...Or, you know. Just have a Pokemon on your team with a Dark or Ghost type move. -
Daaaarknesss. by
on 2018-07-20 16:47:00 UTC
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Nooo parentssssno, sorry, that's something else.
Yeah, it's Dark-type. It's not a Dark-type move, it's just... darkness. And the ghosts are just ghosts. ^^
However, you're absolutely right that that's not really what 'Dark' in Pokemon refers to; it apparently comes from the Japanese for 'evil', and it's basically Slytherin-type.
I'm not sure what you'd use as a physical embodiment of sneaky backstabbing. The whole point is that they're not actual weapons, so I'm not keen on the gun version; the 'while its back is turned' version works nicely, but might be tricky to work into an explanation.
As for why Sandra and Freckles got it wrong... well, they had just transferred from the DMS, and I don't think either of them know Pokemon. I mean, they also thought <a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/169FF6AOFyOqkrm1VFDRIwUHKWBT4q0ljZJjZvyYi9I/pub">Agent Atlas was a canon character, so they're hardly experts in everything... ;)
hS -
Only other thing I can think of is... by
on 2018-07-20 19:29:00 UTC
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...smacking them over the head with a small bag filled with thirty silver coins or whatever equivalent currency in the fic's canon (say, thirty bottlecaps, or thirty Sickles), as a reference to what Judas got for betraying Christ. But at *that* point, we're back at Christian stuff, and there's not much point in using it over the Bell, Book, and Candle.
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You'd have to find something canon-appropriate. by
on 2018-07-20 20:10:00 UTC
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So if you were in Middle-earth, you could chuck an action figure of Saruman at it, drawing on his betrayal. And so on and so forth.
hS -
That actually sounds perfect! by
on 2018-07-20 20:56:00 UTC
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So, say, in the Fallout Wasteland, you'd slap them with a rolled-up checkered suit to draw upon the betrayal and backstabbery of Benny in New Vegas. (Or perhaps pistol-whip them with a 9mm pistol, because Benny's choice of weaponry is the unique 9mm pistol Maria, but that's a little more of a stretch and obviously involves actual weaponry.)
Or in Terraria, you'd pelt them with rotten eggs or bonk them with a Clothier Voodoo Doll or Guide Voodoo Doll, all three of which allow the player character to kill their own NPC allies. (Do they make fics about Terraria? They almost certainly make fics about Terraria...)
Or in Equestria, you could use the goggles of a Shadowbolt, the fictitious group Nightmare Moon used as an (unsuccessful) ploy to get Rainbow Dash to abandon her newfound friends in the pilot.
I love it! -
We took note of this error. by
on 2018-07-20 10:49:00 UTC
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If we ever become a canonical department, and then find some agents who are sufficiently versed in the Fallout canon, we may do something about it.
The Snowdrop, Unofficial Head of Department, Uncanonical Department of Inaccuracies
Hi, Hieronymus Graubart here. Welcome back; I remember you.
Officially taking note by PPCing the mission is all we potentially can do to prevent the undead Stu from coming back and complain about not having been slain properly. Unfortunately, the Department of Inaccuracies exists only in the badfic games yet.
Also, I’m currently hosting copies of ShatteredSanity’s missions on my Google account, and I intend to move them to The Lost Tales so that they won’t be lost.
HG, Archivist’s Apprentice -
Oooo~! by
on 2018-07-20 14:51:00 UTC
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Gonna be honest, I *like* the idea of a Department of Inaccuracies. The PPC isn't infallible, after all.
Said department would especially help in cases like this, where the author of the mission is unreachable and has probably left the PPC completely, and thus wouldn't be able to edit their own mission.
If I do get Permission (or re-get, since I've forgotten whether I'd achieved Permission before I left- although I'm pretty sure I hadn't) and the UDoI achieves canonicity, I'd definitely join in with a UDoI team. (Although I think it'd need a different name once the U falls off, since the Department of Intelligence also goes by the acronym "DoI") -
Even if the department existed, by
on 2018-07-20 15:49:00 UTC
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... you shouldn’t have a team dedicated to that. What would they do all the time? After all, we try to catch errors as soon as possible. Finding something only when the mission’s author is no longer around should be an exception.
I imagine that the Snowdrop wouldn’t have any agents permanently assigned to his department. He would temporarily draft knowledgeable agents from other departments as needed. (Androia and Hieronymus are supposed to be in the Harry Potter Division of the DMS, although I didn’t write any regular missions yet.)
HG -
... which is a thing that seems to be happening now. by
on 2018-07-20 16:52:00 UTC
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I have several agents who aren't permanently assigned to one department, or are Designated Experts. Agent Mortic is unpartnered in WhatThe specifically so he can be paired up with people who need expert help; Agent Huinesoron is the same for DOGA, plus he's Grelvish consultant for SIELU, plus he's in the Geology division of DAS. Heck, there's direct precedent over in the DCPS, where many of the caseworkers are also agents in other departments, and do DCPS work in their free time.
I like it; it's a way to get more variety in PPC stories without doing down the 'they're Floaters so they do everything' (or 'they're Assassins but they do everything anyway') route. Not that I haven't done that too, but it's fun to see things get more diverse out in HQ.
(It also stops the UDoI becoming the DIO take two, which would be... yeah.)
hS -
There's precedent in the DIC and Despatch, too. by
on 2018-07-21 02:29:00 UTC
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The DIC precedent is apparently mostly mine, but I'm pretty sure I was drawing on Despatch and TOS at least in part.
But it makes all kinds of sense. Not everybody can be an expert in everything, so sometimes a team of assassins may need assistance from a disentangler for a knotty crossover, or a Pyro for getting rid of troublesome non-canon locations. Sometimes the disentanglers might need an assassin or a Bad Slasher, because they're not in the DMS or DBS already for reasons. Sometimes you just need somebody who knows the canon better than you, regardless of department.
And sometimes the authors just need an excuse to put their characters together. ^_^
~Neshomeh -
Yeah, good point. Still, I'd volunteer for it. (nm) (nm) by
on 2018-07-20 15:53:00 UTC
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Welcome back! by
on 2018-07-20 06:16:00 UTC
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I think I remember you as Anonymouse. Good to have you back! Have a potted aloe and a Spanish verb tense workbook as welcome back gifts!
(Also, I just want to say that it makes me happy to see people type out long, detailed rants about their favorite canons that show how much they know and love them. So your post made me very happy, even though I don't know Fallout.) -
Ah, thank you! by
on 2018-07-20 14:21:00 UTC
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I shall treasure them always. (And I'll also dress up the aloe to look like Aloe from MLP. Because yes.)
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Salutations! by
on 2018-07-19 23:53:00 UTC
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I pour forth the holy libations to celebrate your return, and give unto you a half-kilo of lembas and a laspistol!
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Oooh, nice~! Thank you! by
on 2018-07-20 00:59:00 UTC
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...Although I do notice that both of the weapons I've gotten so far are Warhammer 40K weapons, which I find kinda silly. (No, 40K isn't one of my fandoms, I prefer my power armor to be descended from the t45-d, I just find it kinda silly that it matched up like that.)
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There are no coincidences... (nm) by
on 2018-07-20 02:46:00 UTC
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Hey, Nony Nonny! by
on 2018-07-19 17:11:00 UTC
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It's been a while indeed! Have a plate of welcome-back SPaGhetti. :)
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Oooh, tasty~! And thank you! :D (nm) by
on 2018-07-19 17:44:00 UTC
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Welcome back by
on 2018-07-19 15:51:00 UTC
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Take a bolter and a mug of Klah. It's the only drink I offer that's relatively harmless.
And it's nice to meet you! We could always do with some more RPers. What're your fandoms? (other than fallout?)
Also, since you are a Fallout fan... Bethesda Fallout or Interplay Fallout? -
Why, thank you! by
on 2018-07-19 16:34:00 UTC
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As for fandoms... I gave my fandoms at the end of the post, after the rant about charges, but I'll go ahead and restate them. (And also add a few I left out.)
Pokemon, My Little Pony, Fallout, Dungeons and Dragons, Harry Potter, and Terraria, among other things. (This time, sorted by magnitude of fan-ness, if that's a term.) Going to throw in Eternal Card Game and Magic: the Gathering, too, although I'm not as well-versed in the latter.
Also, I prefer the Bethesda-era Fallouts, but purely because of the fact that I can't wrap my head very well around the Interplay games' interfaces. (Especially the inventory screen, sweet Mew.) New Vegas is my favorite of the bunch, although admittedly I haven't gotten a chance to actually *play* Fallout 4 and won't be able to play 76 for a while, due to not having a strong enough PC and not owning any consoles. -
Well, then... by
on 2018-07-19 17:13:00 UTC
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If you ever get over the UI, you may want to give the Interplay Fallout games a shot. They're by the same people.
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Re: Well, then... by
on 2018-07-19 17:46:00 UTC
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Yeah, I know. I do own them- I originally got my hands on the Fallout games via the Anthology pack. (Yes, the Mini-Nuke case is sitting on my dresser. ...In pieces, because one of my little siblings got ahold of it and threw it around. sigh...)
I'll eventually get around to giving them a shot, don't worry. -
Investigation: go! by
on 2018-07-19 14:34:00 UTC
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First off: hi, welcome back again; I remember both your previous names. ^^
Right, those charges. The second one is actually addressed by the mission, which says this:
“ Where did he get one of those?” Sylvia asked, shocked. [...] will you please write down that charge. Bullet proof vests aren’t all that common in the Wasteland.”
So the charge is really 'having a rare bit of kit without justification'. You can certainly argue that it's an inaccurate description, but it looks like the mission comes from the period when people felt they needed to list every single charge at the end, which means there was pressure to make them short and snappy.
As for the main charge you object to... yep, it looks like the agents were just plain wrong there. ^^ It happens. Heck, Jay and Acacia once came very close to charging for not having Legolas leave Middle-earth right after the War of the Ring. Coming back to Sylvia and Natasha, they immediately after the discussion of the gun (which presumably has a snakeskin grip, rather than a complete snakeskin handle, which would be... floppy) act bewildered why anyone would use the skin of a dangerous animal to make a holster. Given the existence of crocodile-skin everything, that's a really weird objection to have.
It looks like Sylvia is from the Fallout continuum, so you can probably chalk it up to her making assumptions based on her knowledge of her world, rather than actually checking up on it.
I find it interesting that both 'special' items come from the same character (he doesn't happen to have a Deathclaw skin holster, does he?). If I was doing this mission and knew enough about Fallout, I would probably summarise them all into a single charge: murdering Joshua Graham and nicking his stuff. ^_~
hS -
I note... by
on 2018-07-19 15:31:00 UTC
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Joshua Graham is from some of the DLC for Fallout New Vegas. It is entirely possible that ShatteredSanity had never played the DLC and had never run into this guy. I know I'd never come across him before.
So, yeah, none of this stuff appears in the base game and could easily be overlooked.
-Phobos -
Absolutely. by
on 2018-07-19 16:26:00 UTC
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That doesn't excuse Agent Sylvia from not doing her job properly, though. ;) I've just checked with Legal, and their response was 'an ignorant author is no excuse under the law'.
At least I think that's what they said. It was in Ironic Latin, so it's hard to be sure.
hS -
Re: Investigation: go! by
on 2018-07-19 15:11:00 UTC
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Good point on the bulletproof vest, yeah. And as for the Deathclaw skin holster... one, yeah, even in FNV you can actually craft Gecko-skin-backed leather armor, where Geckoes in the Fallout continuum are indeed another type of dangerous animal. (Kinda cute, but dangerous enough to kill a man if they're not well-equipped enough, with how dangerous depending on the type.)
Two... yeah, no, Joshua Graham doesn't have a Deathclaw skin holster for his gun. ...Partially because, like most to all characters in Bethesda-era Fallout games, he straight-up doesn't use a holster for his gun, it's simply "magnetized" to his hip. Closest he has is a few black pistol-magazine pouches on his belt, and even then, it's definitely not Deathclaw skin. (I'm not sure if it's black leather or simply black woven cloth.) Still, I think the "murdering Joshua Graham and nicking his stuff" charge would indeed have been appropriate. -
Dai Stiho! by
on 2018-07-19 14:06:00 UTC
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A pleasure to have you back among us. /passes along some chocolate bark/
Wouldn't know anything about those charges, though, sadly. :/ -
Pleasure's all mine, and thank you for the chocolate bark. by
on 2018-07-19 14:17:00 UTC
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And it's fine. The mission is years old and was found in the trash of the writer's Google Docs, so I doubt it's going to get fixed anyways, and it probably doesn't matter since the badfic in question was deleted, too. Just wanted to get it off my chest.
...Also, the mission didn't seem to have been proofread, either. There were a few spelling mistakes here and there, and I believe I also saw at least one dropped apostrophe. (And I'm pretty certain that a decent proofreader would've caught the .44/.45 Auto mistake, too.) -
/low whistle/ That's SOME digging! by
on 2018-07-19 15:28:00 UTC
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I can appreciate it, mind, since I'm an Archive Binger myself. |D