Not really ^-^

A problem with Minis. by SilverStorm0 on 2019-02-26 21:31:00 UTC Reply

I've been looking around the wiki to make sure I've got my facts straight when writing, and one of the snags I've hit are the Minis for the continuum I'm starting out in.

As in, there are recorded Minis for it, but only sorta.

For those unfamiliar with Fire Emblem, for the most part the games don't affect each other, or only one or two are connected to any specific storyline. One game has an officially recognized Mini (the mini-Dragon), but that Mini doesn't work for all of the games. Hence the snag.

The least convoluted solution I can think of is to switch the Minis from Dragon to Wyvern, since the two are similar enough it wouldn't be too jarring. Both are generally associated with enemies, but Wyverns are native to all the games instead of the specific enemies that the mini-Dragon is based on.

Of course, this isn't just a decision I can make, so I thought I'd bring it to the Board for debate. So what do you all think?

Well, it's true a series-wide choice would be better... by Hardric on 2019-02-28 05:51:00 UTC Reply

But it's also true that dragons are a big thing in Fire Emblem.

Maybe go for Minis for sections of the series, if that's allowed?

I'll explain: when I had to choose a Mini for the Persona series, I very quickly went for the Reaper, the bonus boss of the 'modern' games of the series. But he wasn't present in the first two games and their remakes.

Problem being than these two games, despite having minor references in the later games and theoretically being set in the same timeline, are pretty much a different system despite being in the same series, with different developpers.

So I thought (all theoretical for now, I didn't write a Persona 1/2 mission yet... and I hope it will eventually be a 'yet') about keeping the Reaper for the modern games, and finding another Mini for the elder games, namely a mini-Crawling Chaos, refering to these two games main antagonist, who is also absent from later games in the series.

Bonus points for keeping Atlus' mascot, the Jack Frost, as a potential Mini for series directly tied to Shin Megami Tensei.

Now, provided a solution like is approved, do you people think going for something like this for Fire Emblem could be possible, choosing different minis for each sub-series, like Elibe, Tellius, Akaneia...?

I feel like it's best to stick with one mini per series... by doctorlit on 2019-02-28 13:00:00 UTC Reply

Just for simplicity's sake in terms of housekeeping on the wiki, as well as keeping track of mini types while writing missions. As SilverStorm pointed out, a lot of Fire Emblem takes place on the same planet, which means it's entirely possible to find fics that involve aspects of more than one sub-series. Easier if all the typos produce the same mini, I think. That applies to the future, too. FE is a popular enough series that it will probably continue seeing new titles for decades; we shouldn't need to keep coming up with new minis for future plot lines in the same world.

There's also the aspect of not using up too many standard fantasy species for a single canon, when they could be used for another series somewhere down the line. Wyverns aren't super-common in fiction, so I feel like FE is a good place to use that as the mini, but if we start giving FE other stuff like undead and pegasi and . . . I don't know, knights, that ties up those kinds of creatures that could have been used for other fantasy continua that may not have as great a selection of mini candidates as FE does.

—doctorlit thinks about minis too much, really
Normally, I would agree... by SilverStorm0 on 2019-02-28 11:34:00 UTC Reply

But it's actually possible to create a plausible timeline of the games that includes everything except Elibe and... I believe a few others (it's been a while since I looked at timelines).

Even if that doesn't quite count, a large portion of the games are flat-out stated to take place on a single continent. At that point, I'd rather just have a blanket mini to prevent logic headaches.

Besides, Wyverns are fairly iconic enemies for the series: it's just that they're not the most iconic. They were the best compromise between the series' fondness for dragons, being a staple enemy, and my own sanity.
Y'know... by Huinesoron on 2019-02-28 09:10:00 UTC Reply

... the Balrog's only in one volume of Lord of the Rings, and doesn't show up in The Hobbit at all. Aragog doesn't show up in Philosopher's Stone, either.

A mini doesn't actually have to be omnipresent; the classic examples are more iconic monsters that don't necessarily do all that much.

hS

Guess I was overthinking it. by Hardric on 2019-02-28 16:07:00 UTC Reply

The reason I thought about going this way was while the two parts of the series use the same core concepts, the use means there is quite serious aspect of 'in name only' link between 'classic' and 'modern' issues, including the bestary. And while the Reaper is iconic for the modern games as hard as heck bonus boss, he didn't exist at all in the older ones, and that seemed unfair to me.

But yes, now I think better and not more about this, 'one series, one mini' is a better way of doing it. Sorry ofr the brainfart.

Not really ^-^ by SilverStorm0 on 2019-02-28 17:58:00 UTC Reply

You just have a different perspective is all, and that's exactly why a discussion on the board is useful.

To explain why the situations aren't quite the same... Fire Emblem's mechanics are fairly standard throughout the entire series, only really changing with minor modifications or technical details. Even if you played, say, FE: 4, then skipped all the way to FE: 13, albeit changed the gameplay would still be recognizable.

That is true... by SilverStorm0 on 2019-02-28 11:11:00 UTC Reply

But it goes unsaid that the minis are still there even if they're retconned in. With Fire Emblem, the different series are so disjointed that each has their own iconic enemies. There's too many to choose from.

I'm definitely in support of changing it. by doctorlit on 2019-02-27 12:27:00 UTC Reply

Dragons are shared as the mini between way too many continua, and Wyverns would be a completely new one. I also agree that the collective Fire Emblem franchise should have a single mini type, so it makes sense to me to make the mini something that appears across the whole series.

Additionally, the only Boarder to have written FE missions has been gone for years, so the change wouldn't exactly affect any current spin-offs or writers.

—doctorlit, really wishing there were no repeat mini types

That's about what I was thinking, too. by SilverStorm0 on 2019-02-27 18:06:00 UTC Reply

"Dragon" is one of the most generic fantasy creatures I can think of, and Fire Emblem is so much more than "generic" (usually). Unfortunately, the franchise as a whole is very closely associated with dragons, to the point that many of the final bosses are dragons of some sort or another.

Wyverns were the compromise.
So if we retconned that... by Huinesoron on 2019-02-27 13:35:00 UTC Reply

... would 'mini-Dragon' become a mini-Wyvern?

^_^

hS