Oddly enough, I've driven that street in Wales.

Subject: Oddly enough, I've driven that street in Wales.
Author: Huinesoron
Posted on: 2023-10-12 08:53:02 UTC

It was not fun. Harlech is ridiculous, there's a whole medieval castle just sitting there on a giant cliff in the middle of town.

The roads of New Cal are actually not too bad! I mean, they'd all carry warning signs, but technically they are all drivable. I've used OpenStreetMap's contours and plotted out a few of them:

(Helpfully, Paint.net tells how how long a line is in pixels, so I didn't have to do any trigonometry at all!)

The overall slope down from the town centre to the south end (red) is about 6-7%. That's steep, but not an official Steep Road. The one section that would be pretty steep has been avoided with a loop in the road - that's not even our doing, that exists on the actual path.

Coming down from the American Quarter is a bit of a struggle. The east-west roads (eg green) are 14-20%. You could drive it, but it would be stressful. The north-south roads straight down into town (orange) are 30% or higher. That's about where the world's steepest roads sit; I suspect they're actually stairways.

The path down to the lowlands (purple/pink) is somewhere in the 10-15% range. That makes sense - we know 4x4s can get up there, we have the photos. So it's not an easy walk back up, but it is doable.

I've not marked the route down from the town centre to the Mueo valley; it would go directly west down that big slope. Um, it's at least a 450m drop in 1200m, which is a continuous 37.5% grade. That's about 20 degrees off the vertical. A playground slide is 30 degrees. What I'm saying is, don't walk that way. ^_^;

My headcanon is that there is some local levelling (eg the top of the American Quarter has been flattened, as has the central square), but the overall angle of the city hasn't been changed. They just do a lot of climbing. It's good for 'em!

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We are pleased to present "Attachments" part 4, the end of Jacques and Jenni's first date! by Neshomeh & Zingenmir on 2023-10-05 04:54:57 UTC Writing Plug Reply

"Simple Melody" - Featuring two immortals comparing notes on immortality (CW for non-graphic discussion of bodily harm and death), angst, flirting, and more flirting.

With this, J² have now dined, danced, and done the deed... just not in that order. Why should a pair of immortals do anything in the conventional way? ^_^

We know it's been a while, so you may want to refresh your memory by starting at the beginning of the installment. Or, if you're new to Like a Wink and a Smile, perhaps the beginning of the series!

We also know this sort of story isn't everyone's cup of tea, so even dropping a kudos or a note to say you've read it would be much appreciated. Cheers!

~Neshomeh and Zingenmir

(Edit: The first AO3 link was screwy; I borked the opening quotation mark.)

Fun! by Huinesoron on 2023-10-09 15:01:42 UTC Reply

I had to go back and read the whole thing... again again, if I remember rightly. I know I read part 1 when it came out, and I must have reread it when the Club Aujourd'hui part was released.

I liked the many, many references to random things in PPC lore (eg weird names, the number of beaches in New Cal). From a personal perspective, I also like the fact that your immortals are as faintly-bewildered about 21st century romance as Dafydd is. ^_^

hS

Thanks for reading again again. ^_^ by Neshomeh on 2023-10-10 23:36:40 UTC Reply

Agreed on amusement at immortals navigating modern dating. (I might have had a similar comment on the story you linked? Will check later.) In J²'s case, it tickles me that they've come at it from opposite directions and are meeting in the middle.

You already know this, but I feel it is important to emphasize for posterity that the PPC city does not have a beach. The city is in the mountains. The beaches are not. Unlike in HQ proper, the distance between the two will not shorten just because you forgot this. ^_~

Thanks for taking the time to comment. Much appreciated!

~Neshomeh

Yeah, they're in the Agent's Guide to New Cal. by Huinesoron on 2023-10-11 09:17:55 UTC Reply

Again, I know you know, but for anyone who hasn't seen it: the Guide and the Map. The Guide describes three routes down from the city:

some people brave the mosquitoes and follow the Muéo Valley and its convenient gentle slope; some like the feel of a real road under their feet, and take the mining paths past Saint Louis towards Poya; and some prefer to stay well hidden, following the ridge west of Saint Louis and down through the mangroves to Nekoro Bay.

What's not mentioned is that each route takes you directly to one of the three beaches. The Muéo river lets out into Muéo Bay, the mining paths lead you down an actual road to Poya Bay, and the ridge route, while badly described, leads through the forest to Nekoro Bay.

None of them are particularly easy; they're all 10 miles or so, with a bunch of rough terrain, and there's no escaping the fact that the city is 800m above sea level. Google will only actually map the mining paths route, but I've sketched them in here:

Bays are Muéo, Nekoro, Poya, in that order. The red Muéo route is mostly level (and there is a road along the river), but starts with a steep climb through jungle. I wouldn't be overly surprised if someone had put in a chairlift or something on that stretch by now? But given that it would be cobbled together by PPC agents, I'm not sure I'd trust it. The other two routes are broadly similar; the incline map shows the route from the head of the road, some 300m below the city itself. (What I always forget is how much of a slope the city is on! There's a 100m drop between the top of the American Quarter and the bottom of the French, it's mad.)

hS

Ooh, shiny maps. by Neshomeh on 2023-10-11 20:30:24 UTC Reply

Re. incline, my headcanon has the city at least somewhat leveled off in the center, even if the residences are heavily stepped. ^_^; When we moved the Door in the first place, I remember looking for a valley in the same vicinity as the original coordinates that looked relatively large and flat—there was an elevation map involved, not sure if it was part of Google, something else, or both—but it's pretty slim pickings up there. Alas, the consequences of choosing a location by letting a game throw a dart!

Out of curiosity, how bad is it to get around in the PPC city relative to the steepest roads in the world? Asking as someone who doesn't understand the math. Like, is this plausible, or would we need a pole of some length to touch plausible? {= )

~Neshomeh

P.S. I did comment on Dafydd's dating experience, but in rambly observations/speculation. Please also consider me amused!

Oddly enough, I've driven that street in Wales. by Huinesoron on 2023-10-12 08:53:02 UTC Reply

It was not fun. Harlech is ridiculous, there's a whole medieval castle just sitting there on a giant cliff in the middle of town.

The roads of New Cal are actually not too bad! I mean, they'd all carry warning signs, but technically they are all drivable. I've used OpenStreetMap's contours and plotted out a few of them:

(Helpfully, Paint.net tells how how long a line is in pixels, so I didn't have to do any trigonometry at all!)

The overall slope down from the town centre to the south end (red) is about 6-7%. That's steep, but not an official Steep Road. The one section that would be pretty steep has been avoided with a loop in the road - that's not even our doing, that exists on the actual path.

Coming down from the American Quarter is a bit of a struggle. The east-west roads (eg green) are 14-20%. You could drive it, but it would be stressful. The north-south roads straight down into town (orange) are 30% or higher. That's about where the world's steepest roads sit; I suspect they're actually stairways.

The path down to the lowlands (purple/pink) is somewhere in the 10-15% range. That makes sense - we know 4x4s can get up there, we have the photos. So it's not an easy walk back up, but it is doable.

I've not marked the route down from the town centre to the Mueo valley; it would go directly west down that big slope. Um, it's at least a 450m drop in 1200m, which is a continuous 37.5% grade. That's about 20 degrees off the vertical. A playground slide is 30 degrees. What I'm saying is, don't walk that way. ^_^;

My headcanon is that there is some local levelling (eg the top of the American Quarter has been flattened, as has the central square), but the overall angle of the city hasn't been changed. They just do a lot of climbing. It's good for 'em!

hS

[Sidles back in with a bigger map] by Huinesoron on 2023-10-12 15:33:26 UTC Reply

Linking out to this one because it is Large.

So I went through and measured the gauge of every road in the PPC city. ^_^ Anything between green and purple is officially "steep"; red and purple are "oh gaaaaawds, why did we have to go this way?".

By taking the main route through town, you can go from the door to the trail riding centre and only pass through a handful of the shallowest "steep" sections. These have probably been landscaped out; I know on one of the postcards I drew the road flat with ramps down (it's Oleander's to Elisabeth).

By and large, the entire city stays green or below. A lot of the yellow sections would also be suitable for landscaping. Everything steeper than that is specific sections deliberately climbing hills; steps or ramps will have been installed there. It's a hilly city, but it's not overly difficult to get around. (Though anyone who's not an energetic biped or flight-equipped should probably live in the French Quarter; the American quarter is a hill with red/purple on every approach.)

The non-Mueo route down to the lowlands, running off bottom left, looks like a fairly steady blue 5-10% slope. Steep for a highway, not unusual for a residential street. My own house is on a 10% road; it's about the steepest an adult can cycle up.

hS

Hooray! by Neshomeh on 2023-10-14 01:14:16 UTC Reply

I'm glad it's not outright impossible. ^_^ And I've never imagined cars were permitted there anyway, so it would mainly be foot traffic plus bikes. Maybe the odd horse, but horses would be out of place in the city center, too, IMO.

Cheers for doing those!

~Neshomeh

Have read, more thoughts later probably. Was good! (nm) by Tomash on 2023-10-08 20:47:34 UTC Reply

Thanks for the note! Thoughts anytime are fine. ^_^ (nm) by Neshomeh on 2023-10-11 18:17:02 UTC Reply

re: first date by doctorlit on 2023-10-05 14:41:34 UTC Edited Reply

Cute! The back-and-forth of the dialogue, and all the little facial expressions . . . Very complex! I’m glad I don’t date! Actually, kind of intimidating!

I was amused Jacques thought Su’s name was a PPC name, rather than being from his original canon, but as his narration pointed out, it does fit right in! Also, that’s an interesting psychological tidbit that Jenni doesn’t like saying Su’s full name. Understandable, though. I also liked the bit about Jenni’s outlook grating against that of the Flowers, and the fact that she’s been trying to sway them behind the scenes a bit. Feels very in-character for her; after all, psychiatric care doesn’t just have to be after-the-fact!

—doctorlit feels embarrassed by this short comment, but, you, know, romance stuff

(edited because I hit enter too early, so very early)

Thank you! by Neshomeh on 2023-10-05 22:14:46 UTC Reply

Always appreciate you reading despite the romance stuff. {= ) The next installment has a mission in it, so you can look forward to that! ... Eventually!

And, uh, I'm with you on dating IRL. I guess other people enjoy the "twitterpated" phase with their hormones maxed out, but it will please me to never to go through that again. I'll just vicariously enjoy fictional chemistry that doesn't interfere with my ability to eat and sleep normally, thanks! ^_^

~Neshomeh