Agreed.

Subject: Agreed.
Author: Neshomeh
Posted on: 2010-08-30 02:29:00 UTC

I always try to do that anyway, unless it's Harry Potter or something I can reasonably expect everyone to at least have heard of. It's helpful if one of the agents on the mission isn't familiar with the continuum--or is just really fond of ranting about errors.

Another thing is the Wiki. In a perfect world, the articles about various continua should give an outline of basic things one should know about the world and its characters, which should help people who haven't read it understand at least enough to be going on with. Of course, that requires people who know those continua to update the Wiki articles with helpful details.

~Neshomeh

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Beta-reader Pool by Sedri on 2010-08-30 01:09:00 UTC Reply

In the thread below, a lot of people have volunteered their beta-reading skills for the non-Sue mission challenge. Considering how hard a time I, at least, have with beta-ing PPC missions for fandoms I don't know, I thought it'd be helpful to have a list of available betas and the fandoms they are able to cover.

For myself, I can beta anything in the following fandoms:
* Star Trek (all series)
* Wicked
* Harry Potter
* Lord of the Rings (though I'm less knowledgeable about Silmarillion and HoME-era pieces)
* Stardust
* Star Wars
* Pirates of the Caribbean
* Back to the Future
* Twilight (yes, yes - shut up),
* Enchanted
* practically anything Disney
* the Mummy
* Pride & Prejudice
* and many others, but I can't list them all.

I'd appreciate it if anyone requiring a beta or offering their services could make a post here, and list either the fandoms they know or the fandoms of the mission needing beta-ing, as needed.

(This really should go on the wiki, too, now that I think about it. I'll go and take care of that later.)

Also - CONTACT DETAILS, please! by Sedri on 2010-08-31 00:06:00 UTC Reply

I should have asked in the main post, but something was bound to slip my mind. Can those of you who haven't already provided an email adress either do so (edit it into the wiki page if you like, or post it here), or indicate another way in which you'd like to be contacted - through your wiki talk page or just on the Board.

I'm working in the sandbox right now to update the wiki page now with all the updates given here, and to make it tidier and more accessible. Feel free to make more changes at need (as soon as I'm done!)
And I! by Aeidhryn on 2010-08-30 23:04:00 UTC Reply

Note: I am best at correcting grammar, spelling, capitalization, and punctuation mistakes. I also am a good typo hunter. However, being a newb... I can't offer much in the way of style, other than having read probably the entire wiki as if it were a book.

If a book is not on the list, I still might have read it...

My fandoms:
BOOKS
*Star of Kazan
*Pride and Prejudice
*Persuasion
*LotR (including Silmarillion and Hurin. Hurin is my specialty)
*Greek, Roman, Norse mythology
*Bourne Trilogy
*Hunger Games
*Mrs. Piggle-Wiggle
*Narnia
*Tamora Pierce
*Twilight (if you make me)

MOVIES
*Narnia
*Bourne Trilogy
*West Side Story
*Pride and Prejudice
*SOME Star Wars
GAMES
*Evony
*Aqworlds
*DragonFable
*MechQuest
*Rome TOTAL WAR
Available to beta by PoorCynic on 2010-08-30 13:31:00 UTC Reply

I've already put the details up on the beta reader and User:PoorCynic pages, but I should probably post them here out of completeness. I can beta for the following fandoms:
-- Avatar: The Last Airbender
-- Batman (Diniverse)
-- Discworld
-- Kingdom Hearts (I, CoM, II, 358/2)
-- Left 4 Dead
-- Mass Effect
-- Red Dead Redemption
-- Red vs Blue
-- Scott Pilgrim (graphic novels and film)
-- Sherlock Holmes (books and film)
-- Teen Titans (cartoon show)
-- X-Files
-- Many other cartoon shows; ask for specifics

I can also check SPaG and dialogue structure. Response times will vary, but I'll try to get anything sent to me back as soon as possible.
I can beta. by Silikat on 2010-08-30 11:01:00 UTC Reply

Might not be exceptionally good at it, but I can still try.
Email: lauraannehaynes@hotmail.co.uk
Fandoms:
* Doctor Who
* Torchwood
* Wicked
* Les Miserables
* Cats
* Harry Potter
* Most things Disney
* Star Wars (but only numbers four, five and six)
* CHERUB
* Maybe a couple of others, but I can't think of any more off the top of my head.
Regarding this issue by raffitz on 2010-08-30 10:53:00 UTC Reply

First, I wanted to know if the wiki page is up to date.
Second, I'd like to make myself available as a beta reader. I'll put the details (fandoms, contact and others) on my wiki userpage.

It is now. by Sedri on 2010-08-31 04:47:00 UTC Reply

I spent half the morning on it. At the moment, your sub-section is practically empty. I'd appreciate it if you would go and transfer the details from your userpage to the wiki page yourself instead of waiting for me to do it - I'm currently up to my ears in work (PPC and otherwise). Don't worry, the format's already there.

Re: It is now. by raffitz on 2010-08-31 10:41:00 UTC Reply

I wasn't waiting for you to do it. It was the best way of adding that info to the wiki without drastically altring its format. You are far more ambitious than me, really.
Tell me if you need any help, you definitely need to chill out a bit.

Erm... okay. by Sedri on 2010-09-01 01:07:00 UTC Reply

Sorry if you got the wrong impression; there are some people who are overly hesitant to make changes or, alternately, too quick to do so and snarl things up. I'd rather everyone did their personal details themselves because I'm liable to make an error that would have to be fixed later anyway.

Also... just out of curiosity... "chill out"? That's an American phrase, isn't it? I haven't heard that in years...

Re: Erm... okay. by raffitz on 2010-09-01 11:00:00 UTC Reply

Yes, it is... I'm not a native speaker and my English eduation was complemented with multiple expressions from films or TV series. As a side-effect, I end up using old expressions or combining British with American or Canadian...

Using old expressions by Miah on 2010-09-03 15:37:00 UTC Reply

I told my kid the other day to take a chill pill, and he just looked at me blankly. My expressions are sometimes hopelessly behind the times.

Beta-Reader by doctorlit on 2010-08-30 07:31:00 UTC Reply

Email and AIM: keyoflit@yahoo.com
(I think; I don't understand how AIM works anymore.)

Fandoms
Full Knowledge:
-Sherlock Holmes (original)
-Chronicles of Narnia (books)
-Animorphs
-Goosebumps
-Harry Potter (novels and movies)
-The Foundation Series
-Kingdom Keepers
-Edgar Allen Poe
-Les Miserables (novel and play)
-Phantom of the Opera (novel and Webber)
-Little Shop of Horrors
-Grease
-Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Blog
-Magic: the Gathering
-Heroes
-Lost (series and game)
-Joan of Arcadia (shaddap)
-The Chronicle
-Pirates of the Caribbean
-Labyrinth
-Pokemon
-Final Fantasy VIII and X
-Portal
-Kingdom Hearts
-so many books; just ask and there's a good chance

Partial Knowledge:
-Stephen King
-Inkheart (first)
-Left Behind (first four)
-Lord of the Rings (movies; I am dishonored)
-Children of Hurin, The Hobbit (novels)
-The Drak is Rising (first two)
-Quantum Leap
-So Weird
-Kim Possible (I have no shame)
-Digimon (first 2-4-ish seasons)
-X-Men (vague bits and pieces)
-various Disney movies, and the novels they were based on
-Star Wars (live-action movies)
-Indiana Jones
-Batman (90's cartoon and current reboot)
-Step Up (1 and 3)
-Monty Python
-Assassin's Creed (first)
-Halo (main games and Contact Harvest)

I have an almost-completely open schedule due to failure to hit the ground running out of college. Please, put me to work beta-ing your stories, and help fight my seemingly unquenchable Pokemon addiction.
Ready and willing to beta by Makari on 2010-08-30 07:07:00 UTC Reply

I apologize for the gigantic list of fandoms about to follow.

*Tales of the Abyss
*Tales of Symphonia
*Final Fantasy X, X-2, XII
>I can read for VII through IX but backup is recommended.
*Persona 3
*Legend of Zelda
*Kingdom Hearts (I, CoM, II)
*Katekyo Hitman Reborn!
*Pokemon
*Cardcaptor Sakura
*Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicle
*xxxHolic
*Tokyo Mew Mew (shhh.)
*Ouran High School Host Club
*Princess Tutu
*Includes basic knowledge of Bleach, Naruto, Code Geass, One Piece, Shaman King, and Loveless, but does not come with intricate plot details
*Harry Potter
*Young Wizards
*Can read for LOTR but if it involves the Silmarillion at all it's a horrible plan
Assorted other that slip the mind; inquire within. I lean toward SF&F and JRPGs.

So yeah.

May I also add something to the fandom-problem-unfortunate-fact discussion going on below? It might be a beneficial practice to go out of one's way for a beta who is /unfamiliar/ with the fandom, who will tell you when something is too obscure or what might need to be explained. I think that might really help readability for some of the lesser-known fandoms. I do try to read missions even when I don't know the fandom, since I'd like people to do the same for me, but it can be hard. I know we can find a way, though. This place is awesome like that.

Agreed about beta-reading unfamiliar stuff. by Neshomeh on 2010-08-30 21:07:00 UTC Reply

That's why I don't mind beta-reading stuff I don't know--in the end, I don't think it affects how well I can do my job of pointing out where things might not make sense. In fact, it may actually make it easier.

One would think we could all be responsible for our own fact-checking anyway...

~Neshomeh

I'm definitely up for betaing. by Pretzel on 2010-08-30 06:49:00 UTC Reply

My fandoms include:

*Stargate (All three series and the movie)
*Harry Potter
*Discworld
*NCIS and NCIS: LA
*CSI: and CSI: New York
*Criminal Minds (Up to the beginning of Season 3)
*Leverage
*Eureka
*Lie to Me
*Narnia
*Sanctuary

The list goes on. Feel free to ask; I'm usually knowledgeable about most sci-fi and fantasy fandoms, but am willing to cover SPAG and general coherence of the plot/story if I'm not familiar with the fandom.
Beta-reader. by Neshomeh on 2010-08-30 02:52:00 UTC Reply

I've already volunteered to do one of Miah's missions, but when I get that done, anyone else can ask. My information is now on my Wiki user page, but I'll copy it here:

Neshomeh is willing to beta-read any type of mission in any of the continua listed in her infobox*, and then some. If you're not sure if she knows something, just ask.

Should you wish to request her services, there are a few things she would like you to know ahead of time. First, make sure your story is in a .DOC file, because she prefers to use Microsoft Word's "Track Changes" feature to edit. It shows very clearly what changes she has made and allows her to leave comments and suggestions in the margins. Google Documents just doesn't match it.

Second, she takes time to read, absorb, re-read, correct, and double-check any story before sending it back, so if you're in a hurry, she's probably not the one you want. Expect the average mission to take at least a week to get back to you; more if it's longer or particularly in need of help. And then she'll want to check the re-write, too.

Finally, and perhaps most important, Neshomeh does not ask rhetorical questions when beta-reading. If she leaves a question in the margins, it means that something didn't make sense and needs to be addressed in the re-write. She has found that people often do not understand this without being told.

-----

My preferred fandoms are these:

*Animorphs
*Babylon 5
*Battlestar Galactica (2003)
*Discworld
*Dragonriders of Pern
*Farscape
*Firefly/Serenity
*Fullmetal Alchemist
*Harry Potter
*House, M.D.
*Jekyll & Hyde (book and musical)
*Lord of the Rings
*Phantom of the Opera (Leroux, Kay, and Webber)
*Young Wizards

But really, if I've heard of it and don't hate it, I'll give it a shot. If I don't know a fandom, that makes it easier to point out what might need more of an explanation. {= )

... By the way, don't mind the yellow highlighting you may see in the lower part of this post. It's because of the <a name="fandoms"/> HTML tag I used to make the asterisk from above link to it. I have not broken the Board, or your internet. {= )

~Neshomeh

Tech question by Sedri on 2010-08-30 23:54:00 UTC Reply

I'm updating the Beta Reader Directory just now - not being sure if you want me to put all four of these paragraphs (about what you're willing to beta) in there, I'm just leaving condensed version that's there now, so you can change it later if you want.

Yeah, that's what I would've wanted. by Neshomeh on 2010-08-31 06:35:00 UTC Reply

I've added a bit more, but it's still concise, which is probably best for that article. Good work on that! {= )

~Neshomeh

No worries. Cheers :) (nm) by Sedri on 2010-08-31 09:16:00 UTC Reply

ALSO: Organisation and Practical Details: please read by Sedri on 2010-08-30 01:37:00 UTC Reply

With so many people taking up Cassie's challenge at once, logistics are likely to become a nightmare around here. I have a few ideas to help smooth this out:

1) Please make sure to update the Claimed Badfic page and check to make sure that no one else has found the same badfic for their non-Sue mission; with everyone going out to search at once, we're likely to come across the same things. First come, first served.

2) Please make headings in Board posts more informative, particularly when relating to missions, particularly in terms of fandom. When there are ten posts in a row entitled "New mission!" "Plug!" "Post!" "Done!" and so on, things get confusing. If there are no objections, I'd like to make it standard policy for all such threads to have headings like so:
* New mission! Bad Het, Harry Potter fandom
* Badfic report! Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, and Aladdin; ratings from G to PG-13
* Beta reader needed! Pirates of the Caribbean mission, 6,000 words, Department of Bad Slash
And so on. It will save everyone a lot of time if we don't open threads for fandoms we don't know a thing about.

This is the best by Aeidhryn on 2010-08-30 21:47:00 UTC Reply

If we can keep it organized- IF- the beta reader pool will just rock. Thank you.

:) (nm) by Sedri on 2010-08-31 01:45:00 UTC Reply

Agreeing wholeheartedly, plus my contribution. by Cassie Cameron-Young on 2010-08-30 02:25:00 UTC Reply

I never expected this much of a stampede, but I think the suggested organisation is exactly what's needed. Thanks for jumping in to save the situation before it gets too crazy, Sedri. :D

As for my offer to beta, I can handle the following fandoms:

- Lord of the Rings, including Silmarillion-era and bits of HoME
- Harry Potter
- Discworld
- Good Omens
- Redwall (up to High Rhulain)
- Chronicles of Narnia (bookverse)
- Pirates of the Caribbean
- The Belgariad/Malloreon and Elenium/Tamuli

Wishing everyone the very best of luck!

Most welcome. (Also, wiki) by Sedri on 2010-08-30 03:08:00 UTC Reply

I don't think I listed Narnia in mind - damn. I just forgot.

I know we have a beta-reader page up on the wiki - unless anyone objects, I'm planning to flesh it out dramatically, with all these sorts of details, so fools like me who forget a fandom or two can add them. If you guys don't mind, I'll add everything on this post there as it comes in.

And since I'm on a roll: Fandoms - opinions, please? by Sedri on 2010-08-30 01:44:00 UTC Reply

It seems to me that one of the most un-dealt-with problems around here is the issue of fandoms. With the possible exception of Lord of the Rings, I doubt there's a single fandom that everyone here knows. In a thread below, Miah pointed out that it's disheartening to get very few reviews for a mission, and she's right - I often can't read a mission because I just don't know the fandom, and I feel bad for it, but I know I wouldn't be able to understand, let alone provide useful feedback. It also makes things difficult in terms of overall PPC organisation, the wiki, and badfic discussions.

Short of everyone here trying to become familiar with every fandom in the world - which isn't even possible and beyond the scope of a practical solution - does anyone have any idea how we could make this easier to deal with? My above post about labelling plug threads will help, but that's all I can come up with. I'm not even really sure what the problem is, or if we can call it a "problem" rather than "an unfortunate fact".

Hm... by Firebird766 on 2010-08-30 02:14:00 UTC Reply

I know I will occasionally read a mission in a fandom I don't know, but if it's too hard to tell what's going on I'll usually backspace. Maybe if we try to include very basic information about said fandom's setting and characters so as to make it easier for readers who don't necessarily know why it's so bad that X happened?

Agreed. by Neshomeh on 2010-08-30 02:29:00 UTC Reply

I always try to do that anyway, unless it's Harry Potter or something I can reasonably expect everyone to at least have heard of. It's helpful if one of the agents on the mission isn't familiar with the continuum--or is just really fond of ranting about errors.

Another thing is the Wiki. In a perfect world, the articles about various continua should give an outline of basic things one should know about the world and its characters, which should help people who haven't read it understand at least enough to be going on with. Of course, that requires people who know those continua to update the Wiki articles with helpful details.

~Neshomeh

Seconded by Miah on 2010-08-30 03:43:00 UTC Reply

I try to make things make sense to non-fans in my missions. I need to check the most recent ones before I post them to be sure that I still am. I can see how that gets really tough when you are extremely familiar with the canon or on higher order missions.
I've had the Star Trek article on my to-do list for a while by Sedri on 2010-08-30 03:06:00 UTC Reply

I did the Wizard of Oz/Wicked article, with the same goal as I think you're talking about here - I want to flesh out the Star Trek article anyway, so if that's the kind of thing you mean, I'll push it up the list. Regardless, that sort of thing would be very helpful.

If nothing else - particularly if no one can seem to find the time - perhaps we can make links in our wiki articles to the wikipedia articles (or relevant media wikis, if they exist) for said fandoms; in the past, I've linked to such pages "for more information" after writing a short article on a character. Think that's a good idea?