Ithinkk it's more about finding the right balance.

"He Said, She Said": Is There Any Cooler Way To Show Dialog by Nord Ronnoc on 2015-02-18 08:07:00 UTC Reply

"Huh, this is a cool article. Perhaps I should share it with the others. After all, I did post the link on my Twitter account." I posted said link here: http://io9.com/he-said-she-said-is-there-any-cooler-way-to-show-di-1686396684

Wow This Is Huge Coincidence by Fasoula (mobile-mode) on 2015-02-18 13:32:00 UTC Reply

We just discussed the subject of dialogue in my Creative Writing class yesterday. We're reading "The Making Of A Story" and the author's advice is almost literally the exact same as this author's. That parallelism is pretty cool.
Also, I want to highlight one of the comments: by Huinesoron on 2015-02-18 13:13:00 UTC Reply

I've attended numerous writing panels at conventions and read many articles in which writers are told not to use adverbs with dialogue tags, and to keep dialogue tags simply 'said'. I have always resented that advice, because I used to think it made some dialogue seem flat. But your comment about making the dialogue do the work gave me a small epiphany. It's the dialogue's job to convey the emotion, not the job of the dialogue tags. If the dialogue is flat without adverbial tags, then that's the fault of the writer for not writing more colorful dialogue.

That, right there. I... don't think I even need to add anything. Except that I'm still working on that myself.

hS

Ithinkk it's more about finding the right balance. by Iximaz on 2015-02-18 13:31:00 UTC Reply

Mostly because if I realize I've read 'said' twenty times in a row, it jars me out of the story. Not saying it's true, but it gives the impression that the author either had a fit of laziness or just couldn't think of something better to use.

Then again, you find those stories where the author seems to be allergic to 'said' and you find all sorts of random dialogue tags, even when they don't fit. I once wrote a parody where I refused to use 'said' and I ended up with the weirdest dialogue tags.

Besides, sometimes you do need dialogue tags to convey a certain emotion.

"Look out!" Jack said. Well, if it's so important to look out, why are you saying it? Sure, the exclamation point suggests he's yelling, but when you see 'said', it just doesn't seem to fit. (Of course, that might just be my opinion talking.)

"Look out!" Jack yelled. Here, it sounds like he's actually urgent.

Anyway, that's my brain vomit for today.

I don't know... by Fasoula (mobile-mode) on 2015-02-18 14:10:00 UTC Reply

Honestly, said sounds a lot better to me in that example. There's nothing about the word said that would negate the intensity of the dialogue. Said is like a blank slate, it just means to make an utterance. Which could mean making an utterance of any sort, from what I gather.

"Look out!" John yelled seems redundant because the reader likely already figured out that the character is probably yelling, then the author tells them they're yelling. This might feel to the reader like the author didn't trust then to figure it out on their own, like the article said.

But, personally I feel like that would actually be the best time to use a gesture to support the dialogue rather than an attribution. John is probably not just standing stock still. Is he reaching out a hand to pull his companion out of danger? Ducking so he doesn't get smacked in the face by the whatsit he is warning them about? I feel like a gesture would paint a much clearer picture.

Just my two cents (which may have turned into something more like a dime. Oops.).
True, but... by Huinesoron on 2015-02-18 13:46:00 UTC Reply

"Look out!" Jack ducked under the fence and grabbed the little girl just as the runaway rhinoceros hurtled past.

A lot of the time, the tags are unnecessary anyway.

But yeah, somewhere someone pointed out that actual descriptions - yelled, whispered, mumbled - are useful quite a lot. Commanded, decreed, protested, and waffled are much less so, and should be conveyed through the dialogue. Heck, you can probably match them up to the following lines easily, even with no context:

"Take her to the brig."
"You can't lock me up!"
"You have endangered every person on this ship; you will be confined until we reach port."
"Actually, Captain, according to the regulations, specifically section VII part 8 subheading a.ii.kappa, as revised in the third quarter of last year..."

The reason you'd need anything other than straight dialogue there is to highlight that line 4 is a third speaker. But you definitely don't need dialogue tags.

hS

"In fact, the best dialogue usually stands on its own..." by Huinesoron on 2015-02-18 09:10:00 UTC Reply

That's exactly what I tried to do in Maethorwen's recruitment, and probably on other occasions too: literally tell the story through the dialogue. It can be quite challenging, though (but that's fun!).

What's weird about that article is that it takes so long to hit what I think is the key way to remove extraneous saids: use the narrative as your dialogue tags. Which is exactly what you've done with your post, of course. ;)

"If you have to break them, could you at least do so a little less... explosively?" Makes-Things took the bundle of CAD parts and dropped them onto his desk. Is there any way that would've improved by running "... explosively?" said Makes-Things, taking...?

(Ans: probably in some contexts, yes. But not a whole lot)

(Now I've got a plot-Nuzgul nagging me to write a worksheet for PPC schoolkids to learn proper writing. 'Complete this sentence: Jay has stabbed the Mary-Sue, and the Mary-Sue...

-... dies.
-... is dying.
-... died.
-... did die.
-... is done doing being dead.')

hS