Subject: Well...
Author:
Posted on: 2015-12-07 07:48:00 UTC
You don't need any particular trait in a story in order for concrit to work, you just need an author that is willing to listen. Of course, some times the only concrit one can offer is "table this, start again from the beginning".
I learn this the hard way by being blocked on DA after wasting such a long time trying to tell an author why her fanfictions were bad, and how she could improve it.
*sigh*
Yeh, I saw a piece of essay before, saying that constructive criticisms only worked when the stories have some merits to begin with, and when the author is willing to listen to it.
But I thought maybe it was possible to persuade one of them, and when I found a definitely mission-worthy Bleepfic series, my first reaction was to post a LONG essay of constructive criticism.
I was so wrong.
After the author kicked up two tantrums in the comment sections and I replied to each one of them, telling her why excuses like "THIS IS ONLY A FANFICTION!!!" would not work(calmly and politely without any personal insults).
Then she blocked me and hidden all previous conversations, with one final outburst:
"Okay,if you are just here to make fun of it, then honestly **** off. I'm srsly done with all of this. "
Miss Naïve Confidence that one can persuade a fangirl, let her see her mistakes and correct them got a One-Hit-KO.
Yep, totally. Holding back my burning frustrations to be as nice as possible in the comments to give useful advices, and got a "**** off" right in the face as my reward.
Geez, I thought I was the one who was suppose to be mean, overreacting and rude.
Guess I deserve this after all, ignoring wise advices that came from past experiences of oldbies......
*sigh again*
Now I should go working on my permissions, add that nasty Bleepfic series to my future mission list and grab a few bottles of Bleepka to erase the horrifying mental images brought to me by that series.
[Lesson learnt: Some people just will not take any critiques, even when it make sense.]
[ Do not waste your time on any badfics that obviously threw all canon laws out of the window, they do not have any standards to begin with, and definitely do not deserve constructive criticisms.]
It's wise to bear in mind that many badficcers are inexperienced at writing and thus may also be inexperienced at being critiqued. Being confronted with an essay on why their story sucks is tough for anybody, let alone someone who may never have received a real critique before. Do you think you might have come on a bit strong?
Links to the fic and your concrit would help very much in answering this question.
~Neshomeh
I was probably a little emotional when I posted this thread. Yep, being misconstrued by someone I was trying to help really get on my nerves, but like what you had said, taking criticisms need experience and passion.
That Bleepfic series, according to my observations, had never received any negative feedbacks before until someone who was as traumatized as me posted a hyperbolic comment, and my critiques was actually written down under the author’s reply to her. That could possibly explain why the author had such a bad reaction to negative feedbacks——she was indeed inexperienced in receiving criticisms.
I tried to be as polite as possible in the critiques, but maybe I am still too blatant when pointing out mistakes instead of trying to talk about them in a more subtle manner. Making people accept criticisms is also a skill, and I definitely need to practice on it. Thank you for telling me that.
I would like to give you a link to the series, but unfortunately, my critiques and conversations with the author had all been hidden by her, so you will not be able to see it. I kept one of the draft for the critiques on my computer, but due to the fact that I am still in China, I cannot actually posted it onto a google document and share it with you. Sorry about that.
Here is the series(Warning: NSFW/NSFB) http://bloodyfangs75.deviantart.com/gallery/48340614/SCP-shipping
P.s. Yep, a whole series of smut might be not so horrifying in some other continuum, but this is SCP Foundation Universe we are talking about. If you know about the nature and canon of this continuum, it will be no surprise that this SCP Shipping series is indeed a collection of Bleepfics.
My critiques is on the second one of the Journal series, and if you are not sure, just look at the comment sections of each fiction. A whole jumble of “hidden by owner” comments are quite easy to spot.
Just read the two "Journal" stories. They are bad, and also funny in how formulaic and frankly boring they are. Plus, who writes stuttering in a journal entry? Very amusing. I don't know the continuum or the characters involved, so it's not hurting my brain, but yeah, needs a good solid critique for sure.
And, judging by the author's response to a simple "WTF?", which they could have simply ignored, we are certainly dealing with a very thin-skinned, defensive individual. Sheesh.
Any chance of you posting some or all of your review here on the Board?
~Neshomeh, even more curious now.
As Desdendelle said, it very much depends on whether the author genuinely cares about their writing and how to improve it, and whether they're open enough to accept criticism. Unfotunately turns out that most badfic writers I've personally encountered don't seem to fit into either of those - which is somewhat infuriating, but also kind of a shame at the same time.
I had actually met badfic writers who cared about their stories, and after meeting very harsh and blatant critics, they accepted them humbly.
Some of them had really listen and did everything to change their writings, and after a few years, they become writing stars in the community.
That is the reason why I got a nasty surprise trying on different type of writers. Guess too much success and positive experiences in the past does not help.
*Facepalm*
If you read Agent Kaitlyn's Concrit at the end of every PPC: Driftwood mission, you can see how I tackled it. My key strategy was to draw out the positive ideas, which are pretty much always there, and take an 'it's a shame you didn't do [this] with the idea rather than [what you did], because that would've been awesome'.
I also made use of straight-up compliments for things that were actually done well, along with explanations for why they were good. From the first mission:
I'm impressed that you didn't feel the need to shoehorn Elsa's magic in right from the start, instead waiting for the time when it would make a proper impact on the story (and on Legolas!).
That way, if it was blind chance that they got it right, maybe they'll remember it for next time. ^_^
hS
A very serious continuum in general, and though this series of smut, Scriptfics and crack pairings may not be as horrifying and obnoxious in other continuum, it had definitely caused severe damage to the SCP Foundation canon due to its complete disregard of canon laws.
Thus, it qualified as a Bleepfic series in this situation. Not to mention OOCness, large amount of squicks and Bad Biology.......
After reading this, now I simply must know! Can you please add a link to this fanfiction that spawned a veritable essay of concrit? Or is me asking for that indecorous?
Here is the series(Warning: NSFW/NSFB)
http://bloodyfangs75.deviantart.com/gallery/48340614/SCP-shipping
You will not be able to see the criticisms I made, though. They were hidden by the author.
You don't need any particular trait in a story in order for concrit to work, you just need an author that is willing to listen. Of course, some times the only concrit one can offer is "table this, start again from the beginning".
Not all attempts at giving concrit are doomed to fail. I was successful(ish) once.
As I was looking through the Bakugan section of FFN, I ran across this series of fics. At first, the OC was believable, and what was then portrayed as the main conflict (the OC's sister mysteriously disappeared some time ago) was quite intriguing. But as the series went on, the OC became more and more Sueish, up to the point where the Sue became a "secret member" of the Battle Brawlers (the protagonists) and was actually a behind-the-scenes catalyst for canon events. That, on top of a clearly Sueish power, made me stop reading and offer some concrit. You know what? She actually took it to heart--but was about to resolve it the wrong way: "I sometimes forget to point out her flaws and her overall rebellious attitude which can get in the way sometimes. ... I will try to de-sue her some more."
Fortunately, I responded quickly and got someone else to help clarify what made her OC a Sue.
I say "successful(ish)" because I don't know if she's gotten around to fixing them yet (though at least there are no further entries in the series), but I'm sharing this to say that success is possible. There are authors willing to listen.
I mean, I also made this type of constructive criticisms before on Chinese forums and writing communities, where people are much harsher and intolerant to bad writings.
I actually persuaded a couple of author using the same methods on that Bleepfic series, and though no further response was received, they accepted the advices genuinely.
Of course, those who were much more insolent and snobbish had already been sporked right in the face without any mercy by Very Harsh Critics in the community.
I guess this is the first time I tried that on someone who obviously did not want to listen to any critiques right from the start.
No wonder I failed. Maybe I should pick a better one next time.
There was one Warriors fic I found that summarized the first two chapters in a run-on sentence and was an Agnst!fic for sure, all in the summary. And then it had to say at the end, "I suck at summaries!" Seriously, I'm sick of that sentence. If we can't trust the author with a summary, why should we trust them with the story?
Fortunately, the story had only three very short chapters so far. So I PMed and told the author what I said about the summary-suck thing, said it was not a good idea at all to have the summary all in caps, and not to have it sound like you are begging for the audience to pity the MC. Thankfully, he said he could see some sense in all of that. Then I told him that to best fix the problems, he would have to delete his story and start over, but that I would help him in any way I could as a beta on Fanfiction.net as he rewrote.
His response: "Ooookaaaaay...?"
And there has been no reply from him ever since. Such a shame. :(
At least no response is better than getting an outburst or tantrum right in the face.
Sorry, guess I was speaking from assumptions just now.
Usually when a fiction's breach of canon laws is severe to a point that you could not find any trace from the original work apart from the names, the critiques one can give is probably limited to something along the line "Would you kindly read/watch the work you are supposed to be a fan of, right from the start?"
Yes. No matter how bad a fanfiction is, as long as the author is willing to take advice, everything is fine.
However, badfic authors rarely react well to critiques. The worse the quality of the fiction, the less likely the chances that they WILL actually listen to a critic.
Well, not always, but still highly possible in most cases.