I'm caught up now!

Subject: I'm caught up now!
Author: Neshomeh
Posted on: 2023-12-16 18:01:08 UTC

I pretty much agree with your assessment of the first two eps, but I... did not really enjoy The Giggle. The performances from all the actors are great, no complaints with any of them! I really look forward to seeing what "Thor" (I think?) does going forward. ^_^ It was just the sheer amount of a$$-pullery in the plot that didn't work for me.

In The Star Beast, I could shrug it off because it was mostly there to make statements and the character stuff was good enough to carry them, and it helps that I mostly agree with said statements even if I'm not sure they really would solve the problems they're purported to solve. ^_^; With this one, the nonsense got in the way of my investment in the story. I especially wish the final, uh, showdown, had been treated a little more seriously. Also the myth part. Is that the bit that was mentioned under the Fourth Doctor? 'Cause it really felt made-up on the spot to me, I think partly because so little time was devoted to it.

IDK, both eps 1 and 3 feel like they were made for people who don't think very hard about things, and that's not who I believe DW's audience are. Here's hoping ep 4 is more like ep 2.

Re. ep 2, though, I still don't understand the Technodrome reference. Maybe it's just been waaay too long since I watched that iteration of TNMT. {X D

~Neshomeh

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Doctor Who: The Star Beast (spoiler-free review) by Huinesoron on 2023-11-27 10:28:49 UTC Reply

So the Doctor Who 60th anniversary specials are in progress, beginning with Saturday's The Star Beast. If you like the Russel T. Davies era of Who, then you are in luck: this episode is a textbook example. Stakes are raised, twists are turned, references are made, subtlety is a myth, solutions are pulled literally out of nowhere. Also, "What? What? What?!" is said over and over and over.

What was obvious is that David Tennant was having so much fun. I'm specifically thinking of the scene in the white room, but he spent the whole episode Doctoring up to, er... 14, I guess! We were very pleased with his companion (who's in all the trailers but I know people don't necessarily see those); a well-deserved appearance. And we can't fault the ending.

In conclusion, simultaneously spoiler-free and stuffed with them:

Wild Blue Yonder (Spoiler-free review) by Huinesoron on 2023-12-04 09:49:53 UTC Reply

Special #2 is out, and how different was that? Kaitlyn said it felt more like a Moffat episode, and I'd agree - in the sense of written by Moffat, not necessarily something from his era as showrunner.

Wild Blue Yonder is a masterclass in suspense. The opening leaves you on the edge of your seat waiting to see what will happen, and once it does happen, well. There are times when the viewers know more than the characters, and times when we know less, and both use that difference to build the suspense up and up.

Tennant and Tate were both obviously having a great time. There are multiple scenes which achieve the holy grail of Doctor Who dialogue: sounding like they just showed up on set together and started bantering. A fantastically fun episode, and here's your spoiler-free, spoiler-filled summary:

(Wondering if I should go back and explain the summaries once the episodes are all out...)

hS

The Giggle (Spoiler-free review) by Huinesoron on 2023-12-11 10:49:45 UTC Reply

The third special is out, and it is bonkers. The other two had fairly easy-to-follow plots; this one roamed all over the shop. Not in a bad way, but it got complicated very fast.

Possibly because of that, this is the only one of the specials which felt like it didn't entirely pull itself together. There's one scene (the one with the bracelet) where what we're told we're watching doesn't line up with what's actually acted, and at least one object which is picked up and carried around for no reason other than that the script needed it. The resolution to the part of the plot introduced last episode doesn't feel like it would... actually fix the problem? And sometimes things happen just because they look cool (which, okay, fair enough).

But for all that it was heaps of fun, and closest to what I think people were expecting out of the 60th Anniversary Specials. The Big Bad was fantastic (and, crucially for me, described in such a way that it doesn't break the planned future of Agent Huinesoron), the supporting characters had me grinning, and the whole ending part was spot on. (I will note that RTD has made a big fuss of doing something that would massively alter the lore. Ummm... no, it's just a variant on something first mentioned under the Fourth Doctor. Bless.)

Of course, we have to have a spoiler-free/spoilery picture summary:

There will be a Christmas Special too, and I plan to review it, but as it's on Christmas Day I don't know when that will happen. Looking forward to it!

hS

I'm caught up now! by Neshomeh on 2023-12-16 18:01:08 UTC Reply

I pretty much agree with your assessment of the first two eps, but I... did not really enjoy The Giggle. The performances from all the actors are great, no complaints with any of them! I really look forward to seeing what "Thor" (I think?) does going forward. ^_^ It was just the sheer amount of a$$-pullery in the plot that didn't work for me.

In The Star Beast, I could shrug it off because it was mostly there to make statements and the character stuff was good enough to carry them, and it helps that I mostly agree with said statements even if I'm not sure they really would solve the problems they're purported to solve. ^_^; With this one, the nonsense got in the way of my investment in the story. I especially wish the final, uh, showdown, had been treated a little more seriously. Also the myth part. Is that the bit that was mentioned under the Fourth Doctor? 'Cause it really felt made-up on the spot to me, I think partly because so little time was devoted to it.

IDK, both eps 1 and 3 feel like they were made for people who don't think very hard about things, and that's not who I believe DW's audience are. Here's hoping ep 4 is more like ep 2.

Re. ep 2, though, I still don't understand the Technodrome reference. Maybe it's just been waaay too long since I watched that iteration of TNMT. {X D

~Neshomeh

SPOILER notes on the 3 specials so far. by Huinesoron on 2023-12-16 22:57:25 UTC Reply

Okay, I could have sworn I had a River Song "spoilers, sweetie" banner to drop in here and protect everyone from, well, the spoilers. But I can't find it! It doesn't show up in the Board archives, and I guess it was long enough ago that I hosted it on Photobucket instead of Imgur. So we don't get that. Though this should cover the preview text. ^_^ Okay, explaining the pictures and some spoilers thoughts:

The Star Beast

The rose: the Doctor starts out panicking about hearing the name Rose, and the tail end of the episode has an imminent doom just like Beast's rose.

Glimfeather: honestly the Meep just reminded me of Glimfeather. It's the eyes and the way they both speak their sound effects. "Meep, meep."

Captain Marvel: looks like the regeneration effects Donna pulls out, but also, this is Binary Star Cap. "Binary" is practically the theme of these specials.

Elsa mug: Donna spilled the coffee. And, of course, "just let it go".

Donna is amazing. Always has been. A lot of Rose's blasé attitude to the alien in her shed (including challenging the person who apparently knows all about aliens on his choice of pronouns when everyone else is sensibly freaking out) can be justified on the basis that she has a chunk of Doctor subconsciously influencing her. I liked the idea that having a child meant the metacrisis was spread out and not as lethal as expected; that was good.

I didn't like "let it go" as a solution, which was a patented RTD reset button. The fact that it was bookended by the bizarre sexism of "a man would never think of [just getting rid of the dangerous thing]" and the extremely confusing trans person who is comfortably trans says "I finally feel like myself" was just icing on the cake. (So she didn't feel like herself after changing her name and appearance to reflect her true identity? She picked a presentation that wasn't comfortable, because it would be if she ever got rid of the Doctor locked away in her head? Sounds like the Doctor ruined her entire life to this point, good job dude!) But saving Donna did have to happen for the rest of the specials, so, eh.

Wild Blue Yonder

Artoo: Robot! In a white corridor! That was given a message by a woman!

Titanic: Well, they're on a ship, that's in trouble. And the captain went down with it.

Labyrinth guards: there's two on each side. And they speak in riddles. And look freaky.

Technodrome: is in Dimension X, while the spaceship is Beyond the Edge of the Universe. It's also driven by mutants and a giant brain, which encompasses everyone except Donna.

Not a lot to say on this one: I think it had the weakest CG of the three, but was the best of the specials overall. The first half, down "my arms are too long", was incredibly suspenseful. And Mr. Isaac was great.

The Giggle

2001 ape: the human race tearing itself apart, plus that little story about picking up a skull and throwing it at each other.

Gandalf: Kate Stewart! And Mel! And the Celestial Toymaker himself, and even the Master's favour accomplice, Red Nails Lady.

Jareth: there is literally a maze in this. :D And a camp musical number starring the main villain.

Thor and the hammers: there's two of them, and a hammer, and they're throwing things to each other, and Thor's lightning looks kinda like regeneration energy.

So yeah, this one had the weakest plot. The initial crisis (the Giggle itself) was unrelated to the main threat. Why did it even happen? Just because the Toymaker was bored? I guess… sure. I'm also baffled that we were told over and over that it makes people think they're right, but when Kate shows it off she just… launches into weird conspiracy theories? Is that what it's normally like in her head? (Though I note Wilf, last episode, spends his entire scene going "I knew it!". That was clever foreshadowing.)

I liked the scenes in the past. The labyrinth, the random creepy dolls, all established the Toymaker as a threat. "Well, that's alright then!" was great. And I appreciate the Doctor's plan: take a 50% shot at winning outright, while having "best of three" in his back pocket. He did NOT want to let the Toymaker at any complex games, not like back in the day.

Back in the present… why did shooting one satellite end the Giggle? We were told it chose to activate after it was fully connected, but why would it deactivate? And what happens when someone puts a replacement satellite up? And, if they could give the satellite false coordinates, why did they need a big gun rather than just crashing the thing? (Answer: because the Toymaker needed to shoot things.)

Bi-generation: RTD wants it to be a big new thing (he's been going on about it rippling backwards so all previous Doctors also bi-generated), but, like… the Fourth Doctor met a partial incarnation of his next self in the run up to his regeneration (the Watcher). In one adventure he met a Time Lord who was acting as a mentor to his own next incarnation; in both cases they merged to complete the change from one to the next. Bi-generation, to my mind, is just the same thing from a different perspective. 15 said that 14's retirement and recovery ripples down to him, so 14 is clearly still in 15's past. At some point, 14 should regenerate again and fade away, passing his essence to 15 and closing the time loop.

Catch: I don't fault the choice of game. If you outnumber your opponent, go for a physical contest! Not sure why the Toymaker let the Doctor choose though. And the filming of it was weird. Can none of the three of them catch a ball?

I should note that there's a line of dialogue confirming the Toymaker's connection to the White and Black Guardians. Something about "Order and Chaos and Play"? I approve of that. But it does mean UNIT have just locked a Guardian in their basement, which seems ill-advised.

I don't object in principle to splitting the TARDIS - again, it's just a temporal loop of sorts. But if the whole point is that 14 needs to retire, why does he need a TARDIS??? We literally established in dialogue that he will keep on using it to go wherever he pleases, so like… he's not gonna stop running! So until he goes, any 21st century stories are going to have a huge Tennant-shaped question mark over them. "Daleks are destroying London, the Doctor is held captive - is 14 having tea, or scones?" "The Master has returned, and UNIT is desperately searching for the Doctor - or will be, as soon as Kate gets back from having cucumber sandwiches with 14." It would be silly enough without a TARDIS in his garden; with one, it's going to lurk there in every story.

I suspect it's a ploy to keep Tennant in play, so they can pull him out again if ratings start to drop. But I feel like it's damaging to Gatwa's incarnation to know that the Most Popular Doctor is literally still hanging around.

I did like the confirmation that UNIT are actively recruiting former companions, though. Because, well… you would.

hS

I think all three specials kind of suffered from the classic RTD problem by Thoth on 2023-12-17 23:55:45 UTC Reply

That being that he tends to... not really care about the actual plot points or how coherent the plotting is, so long as he can get to a resolution that feels emotionally poignant. These specials really show off the worst of that approach.

The idea that the bi-generation ripples backwards creates an even further gaping Hartnell-Troughton-Pertwee-Baker-Davidson-Baker-McCoy-McGann-Eccleston-Smith-Capaldi-Whittaker shaped plothole of why are none of those doctors dealing with various issues, but I suppose the universe is a big place. Honestly I think that whole idea creates an lot of really unfortunate and I hope that it's never canonized beyond word of god.

Most of all I'm just excited to see Gatwa's first real episode. I have no idea what to think about him yet, but I'm optimistic.

I am now reading these for the picture summaries. by Neshomeh on 2023-12-04 22:12:35 UTC Reply

Will likely see the specials soon enough, since Disney+ has them, but in the meantime I like this game. So far I know all those references, even the now-obscure Narnia one, which made me excited to see. I grew up with that adaptation!

And that is the only one about which I think I have a clue, too, given a certain actor who features in both The Silver Chair and DW. ^_^

~Neshomeh, puzzling.

I'm afraid I couldn't possibly comment. by Huinesoron on 2023-12-04 23:43:10 UTC Reply

But I did (and do!) love the old BBC Narnia series. We had everything except Lion Witch Wardrobe on video, and I watched them a lot. I think Silver Chair was my favourite, for all its goofiness. (We rewatched part of it recently; they spent a good five minutes on a dragon that existed solely for Eustace to say "hey, I was one of those once".)

Anyway, all of the pictures have at least two relevant meanings; at least one has three. Some may need context from their source shows; I don't think any of them are private jokes nobody could guess.

hS