Subject: Elsa and Jack
Author:
Posted on: 2014-05-20 12:43:00 UTC
I don't read many crossovers. Elsa from Frozen and Jack Frost from Legend of the Guardians is contrived but accessible.
There is a video (Golden Blonde and Jet Black) that is somewhat cute and probably has some matching fanfic.
When are they good and when are they bad. Are there any particular Cships you like? I have always liked the pairing Joker's Daughterx X-23 (the teenage female clone of Wolverine, long story, comics are weird) J.D strikes my as always trying to keep a smile on her face, to find something to laugh about. While X-23 has had a very messed up life and has a very cynical attitude. They're complete opposites, yet have very shitty lives, so they both have common ground.
Ahem.
Skitter (Worm)-X-Robin (DC Comics)
Now, I love me some lesbian pairings, but in canon Taylor's straight as an arrow, alas, alas. I used to ship her with Cyborg, but after some thought, I realised he'd be too reminiscent of Grue for her, considering [SPOILERS].
Black Widow (MCU Edition)-X-Captain Scarlet (Captain Scarlet)
I've always seen Black Widow as someone who doesn't really date because people die on her; it's a fairly common trope for hardened badass female protagonists in any media, but particularly comics. What does she need? Someone equally badass and LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL. Enter the good Captain, a SPECTRUM agent par excellence who can and will survive anything the universe can throw at him. Hell, SPECTRUM even has a friggin' helicarrier! It's home from home! =]
Clint can have Destiny Angel.
I don't read many crossovers. Elsa from Frozen and Jack Frost from Legend of the Guardians is contrived but accessible.
There is a video (Golden Blonde and Jet Black) that is somewhat cute and probably has some matching fanfic.
While most of them are just your general pairing pictures, there are a few goodies in there.
…They often go right for your feels. =(
That I'd ship NanoFate x MadoHomu in a big messy ball of animé cuddliness. If I were into yaoi I'd also ship Drizzt x Bora Horza Gobochul.
One is a cosplay maniac. The other is quite of a showoff (even if in a refined way).
They're clearly meant to be together.
I'd ship that.
Has it actually been written, or is it just an idea?
hS
Just some three-sentence fic from this one thing (some of it by me), so far as I know. But There Could Be More!
-Aila
(In which neither the horn nor the harp appear. Shush)
So you can tell I like an idea when I dash out a multi-chapter fic about it in the space of two days.
The Horn and the Harp
Post-series, post-Third Age. Susan Pevensie’s notion of a guilty pleasure had changed somewhat in recent years... (Susan/Maglor)
(Rated PG, so don't worry)
I actually really enjoyed writing that. Comments & reviews?
hS
Was my reaction when I saw this post.
Favourite lines:
The man blinked. “Lion? What lion?”
The man - Makalaurë - grinned, his teeth white, his eyes dark. “Me.”
Susan calling herself "Susan the Socialite".
“Relax,” Susan said, making sure of her grip. “It’s only a field point.”
The wound was oozing blood, and she considered the hem of her skirt for a long moment - but there was no point ruining good clothes.
“If you want it in the simplest of terms - I’m an elf. A very old elf.”
“That’s two questions,” Susan pointed out, “and they will both have to wait. I need to support your arm.”
“Why did you try to kill me? You’re clearly not a bloodthirsty maniac.”
Makalaurë gave her a tight smile. “I wouldn’t count on that."
For a moment she stared in disbelief, then sat bolt upright. “How did it get this late?”
“The usual way, I imagine,” Makalaurë said. “Is there a problem?”
“Are all Eldar this unpleasant?” she asked.
“Only around mortals,” Makalaurë replied cheerfully. “Or should I say, only around mortals who shoot them in the leg.”
“Why couldn’t you have broken your right shoulder?” Susan had demanded, as yet another hop went wrong and nearly dragged her down on top of him.
“Because I’m contrary.”
Susan felt her mouth drop open. “You want to sleep on top of me?” she demanded.
“A jewel,” he said tersely. “I tried to claim it. It… didn’t like that.”
That, Maglor, is quite the understatement.
“No,” Susan admitted, not opening her eyes. “It’s annoying.”
Her petulance is hilarious.
To the east lay home, and a fairly ridiculous level of inherited wealth. All her friends, her possessions, her entire life. To the west lay an immortal, conceited elf, exiled to the borders of civilisation, and - lest she forget - liable to wandering off with no warning. It should have been no contest.
-----
Oh, this was perfect. If I could, I probably would have quoted the entire thing, but I'll have to be satisfied by the frankly ridiculous amount of quotes I put here. As you can see, I enjoyed the snark immensely, and I love your characterisation of both of them, and the entire thing was so wonderful and not what I expected yet exactly what I expected at the same time, and the little detail that they didn't share their life stories but only the little things, becasue of course that's how it would go...
Oh, and I literally laughed aloud in delight when I read the ending. That was perfect.
(Please put it on FF.net so I can favourite it and have easy access? Please?)
-Aila
I think Maglor's magnificent understatement is one of my favourite lines in the entire story. But honestly, the whole thing was heaps of fun.
And here it is on Fanfiction.net, now with extra author's note.
(And, while I'm here: Chapter 5 of The Ispace Wars is now out. Anyone who's waiting for it - there y'go. En...joy?)
hS
It's a crossover of fandoms I know, so I was immediately hooked. I liked the story, and would certainly like to know if there's more... watching characters bounce off each other is always fun.
It's a very well-written story, and very enjoyable to read. But I just plain don't get your interpretation of Maglor. (I have the same problem with Agent Dafydd too.) Maybe it's because I've not read much of HoME yet, so perhaps I haven't seen any of the bits that make Maglor a sympathetic character. But in the Silm, he and Maedhros always strike me as being like those hypocritical cops from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.
MÆDHROS: "Now listen up Eonwe! And you'd better listen good, because it's gonna be very intelligent, and thoughtful, and humane!"
MAGLOR: "That's right! We're not a couple of typical bloodthirsty thugs who go around committing genocidal Kinslayings and then boasting about it afterwards in seedy Hithlum bars!"
MÆDRHROS: "No, we're a couple of sensitive and caring bloodthirsty thugs who go around committing genocidal Kinslayings and then agonise about it afterwards to our foster children!"
MAGLOR: "And I write poems!"
MÆDRHROS: "He writes them in crayon!"
MAGLOR: "But I've not any of them published yet, so I'd better warn you, I'm in a mean mood!"
MÆDRHROS: "Yeah, a mean mood! Hey, shall we Kinslay them again for a bit?"
MAGLOR: "Yeah! Why not! Chaaarrrrge!"
MÆDRHROS: "Chaaarrrrge!"
First up, this version of Maglor is significantly less sympathetic than Dafydd. He starts out trying to kill Susan outright, and only relents because he's seriously injured and he has the weapons. Oh, he's moderately charming, but so's a tiger. Doesn't mean he's not going to bite you. Ultimately, yes, he leaves her alive - but after what's probably the longest conversation he's had with anyone (other than Tolkien and Shakespeare) for hundreds of years.
But leaving him aside, and despite the fact that your script version is hilarious, I'm not convinced by your perspective on the eldest Feanorians. We know most about Maedhros, so let's look at him:
-Maedhros was friends with several of his relatives - notably Fingon. This friendship persisted after the first Kinslaying, so we can't peg it on 'hiding his true colours'. There was clearly something worth liking.
-Maedhros was the only son of Feanor who stood aside from the burning of the ships at Losgar. Given that his maniac of a father was right there, that took a certain level of moral courage.
-Maedhros actually yielded the High Kingship to Fingolfin; yes, this was for political reasons, but I can't see most of his family doing the same (and I dread to imagine how Caranthir took it).
-Unlike certain of his brothers, Maedhros was committed to taking out Morgoth. He stayed on the defensive line after the Bragollach - unlike Cel'n'Cur, who ran as far as they could possibly get - and helped plan the next assault. It was only after the disaster of the Nirnaeth and the complete collapse of any hope of taking out the Dark Lord that he allowed the Second and Third Kinslayings.
-Maedhros, with Maglor, rescued Elrond and Elros - and kept them alive and safe throughout the War of Wrath - and, judging by the way the half-elven turned out, raised them pretty well.
And ultimately, yes, Maedhros was the one who decided to take one last stab at the Silmarils. It was a stupid idea. Maglor said it was a stupid idea, which says a lot about him. But he didn't exactly do it willingly. Maedhros' entire outlook is based on the fact that they swore not just by the Valar (who could release them from their oath) but by the Name of Iluvatar. The only other use of that Name we know of is in Elven marriage ceremonies - you know, the marriages that are unbreakable while the world lasts. To Maedhros, this wasn't just 'hey, let's get some shiny rocks' - it was 'if we do not (try to) fulfil this Oath, there is a very real chance our souls will be forfeit'.
Was he a nice person? No - he was a son of Feanor, and everything that entails. But he was the one who tried to be nice.
As to Maglor, well, he was a harper, of course - wrote a very famous lament about the Fall of the Noldor. But beyond that, he was rather weak-willed. He stood by his father when they burnt the ships, and when the High Kingship fell on his shoulders after Maedhros' capture, he didn't even try to rescue his brother. And ultimately, he was persuaded by Maedhros to go along with the final theft.
But he doesn't come across as a bad person. There's a comment somewhere that of all the Feanorians, Maglor was the most like his father - with respect to the non-insane parts (the most Feanoresque nutter was Curufin, who's actually named after him). Which means he was viewed as the successor not to the Kinslayer, but to the elf who made the Silmarils. Sort of explains why his music was so highly-regarded, yes?
And on top of all that, there's the fact that - unlike Celegorm, Caranthir, and Curufin - neither Maedhros nor Maglor ever displayed any hostility towards mortals. I'm sure they had as much disdain as you could ask for... but Caranthir left the Haladin to die in order to get an edge in negotiations, and Cel'n'Cur wanted to cut Beren loose without any aid whatsoever. Maedhros and Maglor accepted the service and fealty of Uldor and Bor, and fought alongside them in the Nirnaeth - which didn't turn out too well, all things considered, but that wasn't their fault.
And on top of all that - Maglor's the one who never went home.
--he who harps upon the far
forgotten beaches and dark shores
where western foam for ever roars:
Maglor, whose voice is like the sea.
That, ultimately, is why he's a sympathetic character - because I sympathise with him.
hS
...especially the full explanation of why it mattered so much that the Oath was in the name of Iluvatar. (That was never really very clear in the published Silm.)
I agree that M&M were the least worst of a very bad bunch, at the start of the story anyway. OTOH that's really saying very much, is it? (And I'm not sure why you mention Maglor being a harper. Being in the entertainment business doesn't mean he has a licence to commit crimes and get away with it, as the news keeps reminding us these days!)
But anyway you've given me a lot of things to look out for when I return to making my way through HoME. (AIUI most of the important background information about Elves is in MR and PoME, so I've got a long way to go! Maybe I'll have changed my mind by then.)
Why is Maglor being a harper relevant? Well, mostly it's not, I was just trying to list everything we knew. But you could look at the fact that his only named song is a lament entitled 'The Fall of the Noldor', which is partly about the First Kinslaying. If nothing else, it shows that he had some regrets - and wasn't afraid to air them to the world.
Points two and three are things I thought of a bit later, so:
2/ The view of the Feanorians as bloodthirsty maniacs who go a'kinslaying at the drop of a hat is accurate possibly overly simplistic. If we ignore Cel'n'Cur's despicable behaviour in Nargothrond (which is at least a kinslaying-by-proxy), there are only three incidents. Heck, even if we include both Nargothrond and Losgar (where the burning of the ships led directly to the deaths on the Grinding Ice) there's only five - in over six hundred years.
And they're pretty spaced out. Alqualonde was about twenty years before Losgar, according to Tolkien. Nargothrond was ten years after the Bragollach - which makes it four hundred and sixty-six years after the Rising of the Sun. Doriath was destroyed forty years after that, and then there was another thirty-two years before the Sons of Feanor attacked the Havens of Sirion.
My point is that the minimum time the Feanorians went between bouts of murdering was twenty years. That's... a very long time for people viewed as serial killers, and they managed nearly five hundred years without any Kinslaying at all. They were clearly able to keep a lid on their tempers most of the time.
3/ I also hadn't realised this: the Kinslayings were not the actions of a murderous family. They were actually national acts of warfare. We don't normally think of the Houses of the Eldar as nations - but that's what they were. So, if you will, it was the Kingdom of Feanor which attacked the Kingdom of Alqualonde - not just some elf with a sword.
Equally, though the Silmarillion just states 'the sons of Feanor' were the perpetrators of the other two Kinslayings - it also says 'the sons of Feanor' defended the eastern marches. Do we imagine Maglor held his Gap all by himself? That Maedhros was the only elf in Himring? Of course not. So why do we all - including me - picture just them attacking Doriath and Sirion?
Rather than seeing the Second Kinslaying as a massacre, picture it for a moment as a culmination of long tensions between two neighbouring countries. The Kingdom of Doriath had banned all Feanorian citizens from entering its borders, and had actually forbidden their native language from being spoken - even in their own country. Meanwhile, the Kingdom of Feanor was guarding Doriath from the terrible threat of Morgoth - and getting nothing in return, nor even any reinforcements. In fact, every nation in Beleriand was behind massive natural or supernatural defences - except the Kingdom of Feanor, which was way out in the open.
And there were tensions. A Feanorian ally (Aredhel) was turned away from Doriath's borders - despite the fact that her alternative was facing a giant-spider-infested valley. A vassal of Doriath's king came to Nargothrond - where two of the kingdom's leaders were living at the time on a diplomatic mission - to try and rally support for a plan to steal the Kingdom of Feanor's previously-stolen Crown Jewels - the ones they'd been trying to get back for literally centuries - so that he could hand them over to Doriath. When the princes quite rightly refused to help - and persuaded their allies in Nargothrond to stand with them - they were painted as villains. Later, the Crown Princess of Doriath came along, stole their extremely valuable dog - and later one of their horses, and an absolutely unique knife - and went on to continue the crown jewel theft. Of course there was never any question that they'd hand it back to the Kingdom of Feanor.
Meanwhile, the Kingdom of Doriath had utterly failed to offer any assistance in the desperate war against Morgoth - the one which was defending more of their people than it was the Feanorians'. King Maedhros doubtless sent several increasingly angry letters - except, oh yeah, he couldn't, because his people weren't allowed across the border.
Then the King of Doriath died squabbling over the Kingdom of Feanor's crown jewels, and his successor... still refused to even consider returning their property, or joining them in the now nearly non-existent defensive line. With support crumbling at home - King Maedhros' disasterous 'final battle' had left the entire kingdom on the run - was it any wonder the political leadership decided they needed 'a short, victorious war' to up everyone's spirits?
And it was victorious - the first victory for the Kingdom of Feanor in nearly a hundred years. Except the last remnants of the Doriathrin army managed to retreat, taking - oh, naturally - the Feanorian crown jewel which all this was about. So yes, they followed, they rebuilt their forces (as much as they could), and when they saw an opening - they struck.
Am I saying they were nice? No, absolutely not! The thought processes and course of action I've just described are the actions of a fundamentally misguided nation. But... imagine instead of elves, all this took place in Medieval Germany. In that setting, we'd see the Kingdom of Feanor's actions as fairly normal. The only reason we find them so horrifying in the Silm is that it's an elven book - and the Eldar were utterly appalled by the notion of Eldar killing Eldar. Humans... don't have that hangup. Not to nearly the same extent.
hS says lots of words
I like how the protagonists go from mutual distrust through an attempt to understand to caring for each other.
So now, when she sought her guily pleasure, she found it here, in the Welsh countryside.
guily should be guilty, right?
Actually, I’m not quite sure who this young woman is. As far as I know, Book!Susan isn’t an archer (never really read the books), and Movie!Susan doesn’t have a story beyond Dawn Treader yet, so we can only assume that something similar to the books must have happened there. Anyway, she feels right, which may or may not be due to your talent as well as to being in character.
Ah, you know how bad I am at positive feedback.
HG
And Book!Susan is an archer. She received two presents from Father Christmas - her famous horn, and a bow and arrow. She doesn't use it much, but it's there. Similarly, Lucy gets her cordial paired with a dagger (and Peter gets a shield to go with his sword). According to the Narnia wiki, Susan uses her bow early in Prince Caspian, to shoot down several Telmarines. That might be while rescuing Trumpkin, though I'm not positive. I know the bow is in the films, and I vaguely remember her firing it from the cliff-top in the fight against Jadis, but I'm not positive about that.
(Actually, the more dubious assertion in this story is that she has any skill at healing. I'm basing that on her moniker 'the Gentle', her pairing with Lucy who definitely did do healing, and the fact that she was just about old enough to help out at hospitals during the end of World War Two, so she probably picked a bit up)
Anyway, thank you!
hS
Somehow I got the impression that the bow and arrows (and the dagger) were a "modernization" that had not been in the books.
Now I wonder why Susan’s healing skills didn’t bother me. Maybe I subconsciously accepted that she would obviously be the one who had actually learned what to do when you cannot just "give them a drop of whatever is in this magical flask". And the glimpse of uniformed man we got in Dawn Treader may have made me assume that she was absent because she worked in a military hospital?
HG
The majority of LotR/Narnia crossover pairings (that I've seen) are Susan/Legolas. Which is a pairing that I suppose might have potential, but I've only seen it done half-right once. I like the idea of Susan/Maglor, though. I'll have to look into that. :D