Adding my two knuts

Subject: Adding my two knuts
Author: Hieronymus Graubart
Posted on: 2014-03-12 13:01:00 UTC

One:
Well-chosen Minis should not be disputable. The expected reaction on First Encounter should be like:
“Uh, what? Of course! What else would it be?”

Checking with Minis I remember from the top of my head and know more than nothing about their canon background:
Mini-Aragog – yes.
Mini-Balrog – yes.
Mini-Decker – yes.
Mini-hell-hound – yes.
Mini-Hound of the Baskervilles – yes.
Mini-Luggage – yes (note: everything I know about Discworld I learned from the PPC, but the books are on my reading list).
Misspelled Monkey – yes.
Mini-Rayquaza – Uh, what? Why isn’t it Deoxy? Or Mewtwo? Or (insert outstanding, preferably Legendary Pokemon)? To somebody who knows Pokemon only from looking over his daughter’s shoulder several years ago, and followed the linked discussion, the arguments for any of them seem quite interchangeable. This probably also happens for other continua with a diversity of monsters, so we should be glad that with Missingno we have something unique in the Pokeverse.

Two:
Since misspellings shouldn’t exist in good writing, Minis shouldn’t exist as well, and “But – this doesn’t exist!” or “This shouldn’t exist!” would also be a good reaction to encountering a Mini.

Mini-Aragog – at least should not live in Scotland of all places.
Mini-Balrog – shouldn’t exist, evil creator.
Mini-Decker – I don’t say that a human being shouldn’t exist, but he shouldn’t have a role in The A-Team because him being a recurring antagonist is totally based on false accusations and injustice.
Mini-hell-hound – shouldn’t exist, evil creator.
Mini-Hound of the Baskervilles – shouldn’t exist, evil “creator”.
Mini-Luggage – No, not this kind of luggage!
Misspelled Monkey – May be an exception.
Mini-Rayquaza – Don’t know, why shouldn’t it exist? Why should Deoxy not exist? Mewtwo may get a point there, but Missingno still wins.

Conclusion: If there is a way to retcon mini-Missingnos to have been mistaken for something else, it should be used.

HG

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Pokemon minis by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-11 19:33:00 UTC Reply

There was been a very important discussion going on, which, due in no small part to the Shipfest, has largely gone by the wayside. However, I think that it is very important that it be resolved. If you're interested, you can check out the discussion itself, but I'll give a quick summary:

The discussion dealt with how we should deal with the fact that there are three Pokemon minis (mini-Missingno, mini-Rayquaza, mini-Deoxys).

Iximaz suggested that Missingno should be the default mini type, to which Phobos concurred, arguing that Missingno has been known to appear as other Pokemon. Outhra disputed that, saying that though Missingno has many forms in-game, it does not take the form of other Pokemon.

Outhra then brought up the fact that mini-Rayquazas are already PPC canon, as there is a mission that shows mini-Rayquazas, and an interlude in which mini-Rayquazas are mentioned in passing. After Neshomeh mentioned in passing that OFUs sometimes trump PPC missions, the discussion has since devolved into an Outhra-doctorlit dialogue.

So, the question: What should be done with the Pokemon minis?

Another reason I like Missingno. by Neshomeh on 2014-03-12 18:47:00 UTC Reply

Having thought about it some more, I think the idea of transgressing fanbrats getting mobbed by fragmented data and possibly fossils is funnier than fanbrats being easily overpowered by a dragon-god-thing. Also, I like hS's logic that it's something that actually happens if a designation is messed up in-game, making it almost a natural mini, and I like Heironymus' logic that minis are things that should not exist and Missingnos. are that in spades.

~Neshomeh

P.S. What I actually said down-Board was "I concur that OFUs trump PPC missions." The implication there is all the time, not just sometimes. {= )

Oh, cute! A mini-Boarder! by Hieronymus Graubart on 2014-03-13 15:41:00 UTC Reply

I’ll take care of Heironymus.

HG

Argh, not again! by Neshomeh on 2014-03-13 16:33:00 UTC Reply

As usual, I caught myself making one mistake ("-mous") and completely missed the other one. I swear I'll get it right eventually. >.
~Neshomeh

I don't think anyone argues by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-12 20:21:00 UTC Reply

with keeping mini-Missingno as the OPFU; the question is more "What should the PPC-mini mission be, and if not Rayquaza, why?"

Speaking of which, when has an OFU had a different mini than a PPC mission had, resulting in the PPC mini species changing? Since you assert that OFUs trump PPC missions, I would like to have some specifics, please.

You misunderstood my logic. by Neshomeh on 2014-03-12 20:34:00 UTC Reply

I don't think anyone is suggesting that anything replace mini-Missingnos. in OPFU, either, seeing as it would be sort of impossible, because none of us is the author.

I DO think mini-Missingnos. are funnier in an OFU situation, therefore I think they are the better choice, because "how would this mini work in its OFU?" should always be a consideration when choosing one. The concept of minis comes from OFUM, not the PPC. They are an OFU concept that the PPC incorporated because it was funny and because Jay and Acacia were friends with Miss Cam. That's why OFUs trump missions, not because of any historical precedent of this type of situation. The PPC doesn't own minis; the OFUs do. We just have them on permanent loan because our respective creators got along really well.

~Neshomeh

Adding my two knuts by Hieronymus Graubart on 2014-03-12 13:01:00 UTC Reply

One:
Well-chosen Minis should not be disputable. The expected reaction on First Encounter should be like:
“Uh, what? Of course! What else would it be?”

Checking with Minis I remember from the top of my head and know more than nothing about their canon background:
Mini-Aragog – yes.
Mini-Balrog – yes.
Mini-Decker – yes.
Mini-hell-hound – yes.
Mini-Hound of the Baskervilles – yes.
Mini-Luggage – yes (note: everything I know about Discworld I learned from the PPC, but the books are on my reading list).
Misspelled Monkey – yes.
Mini-Rayquaza – Uh, what? Why isn’t it Deoxy? Or Mewtwo? Or (insert outstanding, preferably Legendary Pokemon)? To somebody who knows Pokemon only from looking over his daughter’s shoulder several years ago, and followed the linked discussion, the arguments for any of them seem quite interchangeable. This probably also happens for other continua with a diversity of monsters, so we should be glad that with Missingno we have something unique in the Pokeverse.

Two:
Since misspellings shouldn’t exist in good writing, Minis shouldn’t exist as well, and “But – this doesn’t exist!” or “This shouldn’t exist!” would also be a good reaction to encountering a Mini.

Mini-Aragog – at least should not live in Scotland of all places.
Mini-Balrog – shouldn’t exist, evil creator.
Mini-Decker – I don’t say that a human being shouldn’t exist, but he shouldn’t have a role in The A-Team because him being a recurring antagonist is totally based on false accusations and injustice.
Mini-hell-hound – shouldn’t exist, evil creator.
Mini-Hound of the Baskervilles – shouldn’t exist, evil “creator”.
Mini-Luggage – No, not this kind of luggage!
Misspelled Monkey – May be an exception.
Mini-Rayquaza – Don’t know, why shouldn’t it exist? Why should Deoxy not exist? Mewtwo may get a point there, but Missingno still wins.

Conclusion: If there is a way to retcon mini-Missingnos to have been mistaken for something else, it should be used.

HG

Misspelled Monkeys... by Huinesoron on 2014-03-12 13:45:00 UTC Reply

... are, I believe, zombies. Pretty sure the undead qualify as 'shouldn't exist'.

And, to expand a little on your point - we're not talking about things that shouldn't exist in canon. Obviously, a miniature version of a canonical monster will be based on something that's in canon. But within the canon, there are things that the good guys - and the readers - agree shouldn't exist. Demons of flame and shadow. Giant spiders (particularly in Scotland). Wooden boxes with dozens of little legs. Hell-monkeys.

Dragon-snake demigods who are commemorated in local myth? Robots from space? Or animate skeletons who turn into broken code? I know which I'd choose.

And yes, 'broken code' does still allow them to exist in the physical world. See: Porygon. I argued back in January that Porygon is the reason for the lack of internet and general computer skills in Pokeworld - because if one person can code a Porygon, so can everyone else. While it doesn't exist in canon, there's a definite space for Missingno here - it's what happened when someone tried to code a Pokemon... and messed up big time.

Which is also the explanation for minis - you tried to write a story, but you put the bits together wrong.

So... Missingno is pretty much a canonical mini: it shows up when the program gets the name of the next Pokemon wrong.

hS

Monkey-Zombies! by Hieronymus Graubart on 2014-03-12 14:14:00 UTC Reply

How could I forget that the monkey grabs some of the gold at the end of the first movie? Well, I’m not such a big PotC fan.

Speaking of things I forgot: Mini-telescreens are another example of “What else?” and “Shouldn’t exist”.

As often, you express my thoughts better than I can do it myself. You probably also know more about Pokemon than I do.

HG

RE: Pokemon minis by eatpraylove on 2014-03-11 23:47:00 UTC Reply

Mini-Deoxys are from OFUK only, and since that appears to be defunct, I think we can drop /that/ idea. Mini-Missigno, as I mentioned in the thread proper, would make very good OFU guards in all their forms because of their glitch powers. Perhaps they could take either form depending on which canon the mission takes place in? (Mini-Rayquaza for anime-verse fics, mini-Missingno for game-verse.)

Or we could do the easier thing and have them be mini-Rayquaza unless spawned at/taken to the OFU, in which case they'll be(come) mini-Missingno. *shrug*

The problem with that... by Outhra on 2014-03-12 20:06:00 UTC Reply

Mini-Rayquaza made their first and as of yet only appearance in a gamesverse mission, and we can't switch the two out because Missingno only exist in the games.

Also, this attribution of "glitch powers" to the mini-Missingno is one of the reasons why I was opposed to the change in the first place that didn't involve continuity reasons. I admit I used the term myself once, but as a way of summarizing its existing capabilities, not as an excuse for allowing the minis to be able to do unnatural things and attribute them to their glitchy nature. Missingno is nothing special, glitch-wise. It copies the moveset of whatever is sent out to fight it, sometimes, corrupts Hall of Fame data, pretty much all the time, and can teleport, shoot water, attack from the sky, and manifest as a pillar of static. That's about it. No special powers other than those natural to Pokémon, no otherworldly abilities, nothing but notoriety.

No one has any illusions as to what a Rayquaza is. No one has any illusions as to what a Mewtwo is. I don't expect many people have illusions as to what a Deoxys is, but that may not be entirely certain because its behavior doesn't exactly scream "mutant space-virus given macroscopic form by radiation". All three of those could be minis with no real objection from me. People will only make a mini-Missingno more overpowered than its original form was, which is not how minis should operate.

Forgot to add the link to the discussion by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-11 19:34:00 UTC Reply

Oh HTML errors, will I ever stop making you?

Here is the correct link:
http://disc.yourwebapps.com/discussion.cgi?disc=199610;article=254913;title=PPC%20Posting%20Board

My two cents by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-11 19:40:00 UTC Reply

Here's what I think:
Though Phobos' attempt had merit (he tried to create a story that would harmonize all three minis), it fails in that Missingno do not appear as other Pokemon; there are only eight forms of Missingno.

It would make the most sense to follow the logic of OFAS (the Star Trek OFU)--and what seems to be the default explanation anyway)--namely, leaving the PPC mini alone, but ascribing the OFU minis to the intervention of some powerful being, as the OFUs' coordinators saw Deoxys and Missingo as being more appropriate to policing the OFUs than Rayquaza.

Personally, I still prefer Missingno. by Huinesoron on 2014-03-11 23:05:00 UTC Reply

Because:

a) It was there right at the start. If the mini is Rayquaza, what did PPC Agents encounter when they went on Pokemon missions before Gen. III existed? There may not be any recorded missions, but RC numbers go up into the millions - there's tons of agents out there we've never heard of.

b) It isn't a major canon character. The Balrog, and Aragog, are both pretty minor villains. Memorable, but minor. Rayquaza is a major mythological figure. Missingno, of course, has no canon status either way, which I think is preferable. (Deoxys might be most preferable on this point, actually)

c) It's downright adorable. Come on, what would you rather have - a green dragon-snake-thing (yawn) or a miniature skeletal Pokemon which occasionally transforms into a living patch of static?

d) It seems entirely appropriate for the resolution to 'we don't know what this should be', to be 'what happens when the game doesn't know what this should be'. ;)

I, of course, will never do anything in the Pokemon verses, and so have no stake in this at all; but you wanted opinions.

hS

PS: When Phobos said he remembered one that looked like Kangaskhan, he was likely thinking of 'M (00), which a) looks identical to the classic static Missingo, and b) evolves into Kangaskhan. It also shares a type (Bird/Normal) with Missingno. By an amazing coincidence, it's also exactly the same height as Rayquaza - maybe the agents who thought they saw mini-Rayquazas have a very specific vision problem? :P :P :P

hS

Huh. by doctorlit on 2014-03-12 06:15:00 UTC Reply

Reading that article now, I think (colors) 'M (colors) is the one I messed around with back then, rather than Missingno. I wonder what I was doing wrong? (Besides glitching out the game code, I mean.)

It looks like 'M can turn into Ditto, Tyrogue and Slowpoke. A friend of mine mentioned that he found a glitch that tried to turn into Stantler in Gen II. I'm liking the "those mission minis glitched into something weird" explanation better and better.

(But why no Pokémissions, hS? The more the merrier!)

I'd forgotten about the Johto Guard glitch. by Outhra on 2014-03-12 21:08:00 UTC Reply

Before I start, you didn't do anything wrong, doctorlit. Missingno and 'M appear under the same conditions in the same location, and share the same sprite. You probably just found one when you were looking for the other.

While some of the other points people have been bringing up are very subjective(No, Huinesoron, I do not think that Missingno is more "adorable" than Rayquaza. I'd far prefer a tiny coily sky-snake to a skeletal eurypterid with horrific scythe-like arms that's prone to exploding with a hiss of static and Rhydon/Bulbasaur-noises into a mess of grayish bio-mist, thank you very much.), I actually like some of them, like how Missingno is, broadly speaking, a canonical mini, since its appearance in-game when the engine runs up against a hex code it doesn't recognize is similar to how minis are spawned when the Word World meets a name it doesn't recognize. Never mind that those problems would create the Bad Egg at any time from the Game Boy Color era onward, I suppose, because eggs are boring.
When you brought up the Missingno that could turn into a Stantler when traded to Gen II, though, I remembered the Johto Guard glitch. Basically, there are certain versions of Gold and Silver's Missingno-equivalent that can mask the presence of other glitches, causing the game to treat those glitches as Pokémon corresponding to their in-game hex code, which would always be a Pokémon with a higher Pokédex number than 151. These masked glitches would be treated as their non-Kanto counterparts by the other game, and would permanently take on the form of that counterpart when traded over. It goes the other way, too, so a non-Kanto Pokémon could be traded over after being masked and take the form of a glitch.

So, applying this to an in-universe perspective, when there are two or more minis around at the same time, some of them could potentially cause others to start looking like something else, but they would default back to their primary forms when brought into a new area, or alternatively, a mini-Missingno in its default form could turn into a new species entirely when brought into a new area, which could retroactively explain the mini-Deoxys as mini-Missingno that had been Johto Guard-reformatted, and explain those mini-Rayquaza as mini-Missingno that were masking one another for whatever reason. The forms of the mini-Rayquaza in the mission were shown to be mutable(one sprouted rabbit ears once its capitalization was changed), which might support the idea that the forms are just guises, and cause potential shenanigans for Agents who adopt multiple minis by having the mini-Missingno mask one another as Ursaring or Garbodor or something. It's almost like Phobos's idea, but instead of casting Rayquaza as some new form the Missingno take or as an evolution of the minis, it would just be a minor and in most cases temporary glitchy illusion ability.

It's not a great fit, but it is a retcon, after all. It's not going to be perfect. I just wanted to say this because, if we do decide to remove mini-Rayquaza from existence, it'd be nice to have a canonical explanation for what was going on. I wouldn't want to keep this to myself if it would end up affecting anything. I'm pro-continuity, after all, not pro-Rayquaza. It's just that up until now there was no way to reconcile pro-continuity with anything but pro-Rayquaza without breaking several rules.

If we do promote the mini-Missingnos to an in-mission presence, though, we'll need to ensure that they don't become too OP due to poor understanding of how they work. A well-written wiki page should help with that, but it's not going to stop everything.
Speaking of wiki pages, have you gotten the Undelete page that I mentioned here up and running yet? If you have, we should be able to mark certain pages for deletion, and then get rid of them without fear that doing so would make them unrecoverable.

Don't you? To each their own. :D by Huinesoron on 2014-03-12 21:27:00 UTC Reply

I just don't understand how you can not find Agent Huinesoron's new friends adorable:

(Don't worry, he's at the OFU or something)

I will add, though, that I have no investment in any of this at all - I honestly don't care, because I'll never use the things. Someone asked, so I answered. I do that. ;)

hS

PS: I... really doubt any mini will ever become 'overpowered'. People mostly don't use them outside of 'look, it's a mini, add it to the charge list'. At least in my experience. ~hS

mini-usage by Miah on 2014-03-13 20:41:00 UTC Reply

I don't know about anyone else, but I've actually featured minis quite a bit, doing things in-mission (a mini-Wraith that rebuilt an RA and helped non-techy agents steal a spaceship), and in the RC before and after missions and during interludes (biggest non-comedic relief action being a mini-balrog that dragged an agent out of a fire and later heated fire retardant to get an agent unstuck).

They're cool little guys. They need more screen time. :D

Love the picture. I'd totally adopt a mini that sometimes appeared as a column of living static.

By the way, by Outhra on 2014-03-14 00:54:00 UTC Reply

If we retcon the mini-Rayquaza species as a handful of mini-Missingno in illusive guise, would you be willing to Orwellian-edit your mention of mini-Rayquaza here to mention mini-Missingno instead? It would be best not to retain any undue loose ends.

I'm fully with you on the minis needing more screen time. They're interesting, and possibly one of the most unique concepts we have other than the talking plants in nice suits. Plus, most of them seem like they'd be a lot of fun to write!

You're going to laugh... by Miah on 2014-03-14 06:50:00 UTC Reply

I spent hours last week looking through old missions trying to find that scene. HOURS. I finally decided that it was something I had never actually put into a finished story.

I really thought it must have been someone else who had made a mention of them. :P I don't mind changing it. Part of the joke (in my mind anyway) was that Miah and the other agents involved had shoved all those minis into something the size of a cooler, dropped it off on the unsuspecting agents and then laughed hysterically when they opened it, and all those angry minis poured out. (watching from somewhere mini-proofed, of course.)

Do you have any suggestions on how to manage a similar effect with the mini-missingnos? It's part of my headcanon for Agent Miah that she is banned from the Mini Adoption Center over the incident, so when I change it, I still want it to be something annoying and traumatizing to the agents receiving all those minis, and I don't really understand how these new minis work.

There is a real fic that was the basis of that joke. Brynjamin, Caddy-Shack, maybe a couple of others, and I talked about doing a mission on it together a long time ago, but never did.

Oh wow! The fic made it through the ffnet purge! Wabloo Swabloo

Also, Doctorlit, Agent Stone was the name of the character who worked in the generic Mini Adoption Center. He's only been mentioned that one time. Should he be listed as an NPC on the wiki?

I know that fic! by Outhra on 2014-03-14 18:50:00 UTC Reply

I was actually planning on going on a mission there once I had all of my Permission requests and future plans lined out! Well, going on a mission about five stories into the spin-off. If anyone started out facing Wabloo Swabloo, they'd go insane before they got past six chapters. Which is, judging by the Wabloo Swabloo chapter length, about fifteen sentences.

Wait, were you planning on missioning it? I found it on the Unclaimed Badfic page, so I didn't think anyone had a stake in it, and I've already had a dramatic climax in mind for months. If you were still planning on it, I suppose I could find something else, but it would take a lot of effort to find something with that little grounding in story structure.

Actually, the cooler-cramming idea could still work. The action of stuffing the minis in the cooler might even be more efficient than it would with mini-Rayquaza, since mini-Missingno are at least partially spectral, due to their existence both as living data and in some cases as literal ghosts, so Miah would be able to fit even more of them in the same space, and then doctorlit's idea of the minis all flying out in a stream of pixelly confusion and anger could take effect, with the added bonus that the mini-Missingno would just start getting absolutely everywhere, since their less-than-solid existence means that they'd be less disoriented after crashing into one another and the Adoption Center agents. They'd probably start taking out their frustration on nearby objects afterward, giving Miah time to escape and causing enormous trouble for her victims.

Where was Agent Stone mentioned? Do you have the link?

Re: I know that fic! by Miah on 2014-03-14 21:21:00 UTC Reply

We had talked about doing a mission on it (this was between February and April of 2010), and later decided we weren't that crazy, so it went on the Unclaimed list.

I just sort of have it in my mind as the last thing that Agent Miah worked on before getting Cali as a partner. The actual wording in their meeting interlude was "Look, I've had a long day, what with battling troll-wraiths with Agent Eileen..."

It is never mentioned by name, or specifics other than Miah later claiming she had dropped off more than 70 Pokemon minis, so I have no claim on it. The others involved were the ones that new Pokemon enough to cover the canon anyway. I'll just think of the one she went on as a generic badfic that had a lot of minis.

I made a page.

In the first appearance, he isn't named. The scene is about halfway down the page. You can find it by searching for 'center'.

In the second, it is in the first segment.

If Miah doesn't have an official first recorded mission now, by Outhra on 2014-03-15 17:51:00 UTC Reply

Then maybe we can address a slight discrepancy in the RC numbering. Well, that's not the best phrasing. It isn't a discrepancy so much as a blip in RC #4096's personal history. Namely, that it's had a lot of it.
(breaks out the Continuity Clipboard) The Response Center was first documented in the long-running Tawaki spin-off, as the RC of Agent Nicholas Duval. After he married Kamkenta Squee and Tawaki was transferred to the Department of Floaters, Nicholas and his wife worked out of RC #4096 until Nicholas was killed by invaders from the Mirror Multiverse, during which Kamkenta was sent to a PPC TARDIS(in light of current continuity, more likely a Dalek Time Ship that was mistaken for/reformatted as a TARDIS) during the Macrovirus Infestation and partnered with its operator, the humanized Dalek Omicron. The two worked out of RC #4096 until a Gary Stu-related mishap required them to use Omicron's old time machine to rescue Tawaki and Tadkeeta from Ramandu's Island in Narnia. The events of that rescue are undocumented, but Omicron brought the two captured Agents back to Headquarters and Kamkenta went MIA. The last documentation of RC #4096 prior to Miah's use of it was in 2009, with Omicron as its only occupant. Then, in 2010, Miah was shown to work out of that same Response Center, with no Dalek to be seen, and no known partner until Cali Still came along.
Are you thinking what Iii'm thinking? If it was "Miah would have been partnered for a mission with Omicron, or maybe two, before he transferred somewhere else and left the storied RC in Miah and Cali's hands", then you were! And maybe... (taps fingertips together nervously) we could co-write that mission? I've really enjoyed the Miah/Caddy-shack/Herr Wozzeck shared sub-universe, and I would love to be a part of it. Maybe we could use the opportunity to tie up some loose ends, too, like how Miah and Eileen met.

Oh, and while we're talking, I've found a few typos in "McKaloy's Fortnight".

Well, I had to get your attention, somehow! There is no need for that second comma.

“ARGH! Owowow” Cadmar flailed a bit from the sudden shooting pain in her leg. Sudden shooting pain should be indicated by some sort of punctuation mark. Perhaps "Owowow!" to indicate continuing pain from the initial "ARGH!", or simply "Owowow." to indicate that the initial pain has subsided slightly, but Cadmar still finds its presence unpleasant.

wrapping her arms tightly around Cadmar’s torso and burying her head in the other girls neck. "girls" should have an apostrophe, since it is a neck belonging to one girl instead of multiple girls sharing the same neck.

“Sorry, I’m just glad your alive,” Maria said with a sigh. “I am too, but un... could you maybe not hold me like a baby?” That should be "you're" rather than "your". Also, did you mean "um" there? The two keys are right next to each other, so it's an understandable typo, but "un" does sound like a noise someone would make while in pain, so it could go either way.

So at no time, did you think That comma is not necessary. It belongs a few lines lower, after the word "bit" in Cali felt his grip loosen a bit and he slid an ominous inch.

Then McKaLoy said, “Did you see it’s reaction to her?” That should be "its" rather than "it's".

Cadmar was sitting on the edges on one of the beds in Medical That should just be "edge", unless she was on all of the edges simultaneously, which would really hurt to do with a broken leg.

Well, either that or I break both your legs so you can’t run off, either is fine with me, and stop looking nervous, I’d give you morphine first.” There are far too many independent clauses in that sentence. You will need to separate it at least at the "stop looking nervous" section, because that is very run-on, and remove the first "either" because it's a little redundant. In fact, each of those clauses could carry a sentence on its own, with only minor rephrasing. Well, that or I break both your legs so you can’t run off. Either way is fine with me. Oh, stop looking nervous. I’d give you morphine first.”

“Don’t act like you’re scared, I saw your browser history on the laptop!” Maria stuck her tongue out. Cadmar’s eyes widened. “Besides, I’m really glad you’re back, its been way too boring in the RC, Another run-on in the first part(replace that comma after "scared" with a period and it'll fix right up, though), and you should replace "its" with "it's" in the second part.

Cadmar looked ready to reply, when the doors opened, and Cali and Miah walked in, in the middle of talking. There are too many commas here, and that last part is phrased a little awkwardly. There are multiple ways to fix this, but what I consider the best solution would be Cadmar looked ready to reply, but the doors opened and Cali and Miah entered, in the middle of a conversation. It takes out the "when", but I couldn't think of a way to rearrange the commas and keep it in without restructuring the entire sentence. It still doesn't read the best, and if I were to remake the whole thing, I'd say Just as Cadmar looked ready to reply, the doors opened and Miah and Cali entered, The two agents seemed to be in the middle of a conversation. Hmm, this has turned more into an after-the-fact beta-reading session more than it has a typo report, hasn't it?

“A little more forward then on our date...” she said nervously. This should be "than" rather than "then".

“The portal wrecking menace that we left in our RC with Dann, might explain why you were gone for so long.” "portal wrecking" should have a hyphen between the two words, and that comma should be taken out.

“I mean, We haven’t seen you for a while, Maria uses the Royal We? Or, more likely, the W was just capitalized when it should have been lowercase.

This caused Maria is burst out laughing. That "is" should be a "to".

And... that's all, I think. At least, those are all that I caught. While I love your sub-universe, I'll admit that wherever Cadmar goes, typographical errors seem to follow.

Thanks by Miah on 2014-03-16 02:06:00 UTC Reply

Oh, wow that is a lot of typos. Thank you for finding them. I really had no idea anyone was still reading our stuff.

I didn't know that the RC number had been in use before. It wasn't on the list as taken, and I never did read very many of Tawaki's stories. Making the continuity line up, and maybe defining some of Agent Miah's earlier history would be pretty cool. We'd need Brynjamin involved to include Eileen and we'd need Tawaki's permission to have stuff with Omicron.

About the only thing that I have mentioned about Agent's Miah's past with the PPC is that she had only been in the PPC for a few months before meeting Cali, she just made him think she had been there longer.

I have been wanting to write another mission, so the idea of a co-write is very appealing.

Yes! Co-write is go! by Outhra on 2014-03-17 03:08:00 UTC Reply

Or at least, you seemed to imply that it was go. It is go, right? I wouldn't want to assume in case you hadn't fully decided.

Still reading? The Miah/Caddy-shack/Herr Wozzeck sub-universe is one of my favorite things about the PPC! I was so excited when Caddy-shack said back in May that there was going to be a new mission out within a week or so, but it's been months and nothing's happened. Did something go wrong?

Well, it's a good thing that Bryn has recently resurfaced, then! Maybe she can consult us on Eileen's character, and beta-read to make sure the mission's good and we're getting her agent right! I think that I have one of her e-mail addresses somewhere... ah, found it.
Speaking of e-mail addresses, would you like mine? We are going to need to make plans for this, and it would be best not to do that on the Board. There are plenty of little dangling loose ends to tie up.
I don't think the Tawaki bit is going to be too much of an issue, though. He put up all of his characters for adoption several months ago, and Lily Winterwood and I have been bouncing Omicron and the other Daleks back and forth between us. Well, more her forth than my back, because nothing I write right now is official unless I co-write with someone, but you get the idea. I'll send Tawaki an e-mail to see if he'd object, but he might not respond. He hasn't to most of the e-mails I've sent.

Oh, and I've found two more typos. One's a run-on sentence that I hadn't recognized as such before, and another is a direct result of an error in fixing an older typo.

“Besides, I’m really glad you’re back, it's been way too boring in the RC, and really hard trying to get a decent meal.” The run-on. That second comma should be either a period or a semicolon.

Cali and Miah walked in. he two agents seemed to be in the middle of a conversation. That's the fixing error. The first word of the second sentence should be "The".

Re: Yes! Co-write is go! by Miah on 2014-03-17 06:55:00 UTC Reply

Yes, Co-write is on. Yes, would like your email.

Caddy and I are just slow on getting our stuff together. It's basically together, but we've just got to gather up those final details.

E-mail addresses are below. by Outhra on 2014-03-17 15:54:00 UTC Reply

Or rather, they're archived in this post. I'd prefer contact through the Yahoo one, because I check it more frequently.

Hold on, I missed a continuity point. by Outhra on 2014-03-15 17:59:00 UTC Reply

Sorry, the Mirror Multiverse attacks happened a few months before the Macrovirus Epidemic, which was the event that made people start using TARDISes for a while. One didn't happen almost immediately after the other. I must have misread something. I guess Kamkenta would have been working out of RC #4096 alone for a while before she met Omicron, then. About a month, if my estimates are correct. (redraws a few lines on the Really Quite Large Timeline Poster) There we go. Now everything's in the right place.
The point of this ordeal is basically that The Lair has a crazy-involved history.

Well, Missingno. are pretty much made of broken code. by doctorlit on 2014-03-14 14:29:00 UTC Reply

So there could be sort of a clown car effect, with the MAC agents opening the cooler and having just a solid stream of garbled pixels pouring out in their faces, with the minis solidifying afterwards into angry little things?

And yes, Agent Stone ought to be mentioned.

Permission to use this picture for the eventual mini page? by doctorlit on 2014-03-13 07:47:00 UTC Reply

Even though it's flagrantly uncanon?

It's just too beautiful not to use.

On that note, a lot of the mini pages I've made have a picture of the actual canon monster. That can be useful for demonstrative purposes, but if anyone ever feels like making fanart of any minis, please feel free to upload that image to the wiki and put it on the appropriate page. The current pic can either be moved down the page to the "Canon Origin" section, or removed entirely and marked for deletion if the page is too small.

Sure. by Huinesoron on 2014-03-13 10:17:00 UTC Reply

Whether hS has an unrecorded visit to the OFU, or an unrecorded Pokemon mission, I'm fine with this being used.

hS

A vote, then? by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-12 22:34:00 UTC Reply

At this point, it seems that everything that can be said has been said; it seems that the positions and their justiications are on the Board for all to see.

So, with everything that has been said, it looks like it boils down to two choices:

1) Keep the mission-mini as Rayquaza, and, à la OFAS, attribute the different OFU minis to the intervention of Arceus or the Sinnoh legendaries

OR

2) Change the mission mini to Missingno, retconning the mini-Rayquaza as having really been mini-Missingno in disguise (a possibility that Outhra just explained could work). The next person to write a mission in the Pokemon 'verse should, of course, lampshade the change in-mission.

So, should we leave this up to a vote, or does anyone else have any further arguments to give?

So, it seems that we're going with Missingno. by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-15 02:29:00 UTC Reply

Could someone then work on the Wiki's Mini page and note the decision?

(With all the Boarders that we have here, it's almost a shame that only eight people seemed to care enough about it to vote.
But who knows? We might actually have some fun with Agents interacting with these mischievous bundles of code. (When are you going to ask for Permission, Outhra?) )

I imagine doctorlit will handle it. by Neshomeh on 2014-03-15 16:50:00 UTC Reply

This came up in the course of his project to work on all the mini pages (which he is doing splendidly I might add).

And yeah, agreed that it's unfortunate more people don't weigh in. That's actually the main reason I eventually did. Pokémon may not be my thing, but this community is.

~Neshomeh

Speaking about Pokemon... by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-16 05:58:00 UTC Reply

I know that I sent you an e-mail already, but did you look over the chapter that I sent you?
Yar. I shall get to it. by doctorlit on 2014-03-16 05:52:00 UTC Reply

Eventually. For the most part, I'm stuck making little edits before and after long work days, and doing bigger stuff when I have shifts off. But I'm about halfway through now, maybe a little over.

It's been fun. I love organizing stuff, but it's also been tough due to having to research canons I knew nothing at all about going in.

But at least we'll have a nice, clean Mini page full of links by the time I'm done! And somewhere to keep track of obscure mini types up for adoption!

I can help! by Outhra on 2014-03-16 22:17:00 UTC Reply

I've been looking for an excuse to get back into the Wiki, and this seems like a worthwhile sort of endeavor. I might not be able to write too many pages too quickly, but I'll at least be able to start finding information or uploading pictures or something of the sort. Maybe after/during this project, I can start working on all of the unfinished Flower pages. The Big Monkey Puzzle Tree's links are probably gone forever with the collapse of GeoCities, but almost everyone else can still be expanded upon.

As a general help for Geoctites stuff: by doctorlit on 2014-03-17 05:13:00 UTC Reply

This site:
http://www.geocities.ws/
Has a search function that digs up lots of old sites. I ran a search for general PPC; found stuff, but everything was already backed up. But perhaps you can find other stuff with more specific searches.

Also, thanks, Nesh. by doctorlit on 2014-03-16 06:01:00 UTC Reply

For getting all those D&D links done.

I, uh . . . did not realize just how many there would be.

Then it appears I'm outvoted. by Outhra on 2014-03-14 18:52:00 UTC Reply

Mini-Missingno it is.

Wait, do I have any sort of authority to bang the decision gavel? Should I hand this off to a Permission Giver or something?

No-one has the authority. by Huinesoron on 2014-03-14 20:33:00 UTC Reply

Or everyone. But a 6:2 vote looks pretty conclusive.

hS

Missingno (nm) by Phobos on 2014-03-14 18:12:00 UTC Reply
Missingno. (nm) by Hieronymus Graubart on 2014-03-14 16:10:00 UTC Reply
Missingno. (nm) by Neshomeh on 2014-03-14 14:57:00 UTC Reply
I vote we change to Missingno. by doctorlit on 2014-03-14 14:23:00 UTC Reply

In deference to the OFUverse's first dibs on mini decisions.
Re: A vote, then? by miah on 2014-03-13 20:31:00 UTC Reply

I've been following this discussion from the original posting, and I think the mini-Missingno retcon is the way to go.
Rayquaza (nm) by son_of_heaven176 on 2014-03-13 19:00:00 UTC Reply
I vote Missingno. But you guessed that. (nm) by Huinesoron on 2014-03-13 10:18:00 UTC Reply