Subject: Heeeee
Author:
Posted on: 2019-07-03 12:56:00 UTC
I knew you'd get into it.
As for Gendo... well... uh... yeah.
Subject: Heeeee
Author:
Posted on: 2019-07-03 12:56:00 UTC
I knew you'd get into it.
As for Gendo... well... uh... yeah.
Yes, it's true. With less fanfare then one might expect after all the buildup, the original Neon Genesis Evangelion (and the excellent End of Evangelion movie, and the rubbish recap movie Death and Rebirth) has made it to Netflix. I've already seen then, but... EEEEEEEEE! First legal release in America in over a decade!
If you like anime, and can tolerate weirdness, depression, or that one scene in End of Evangelion that is definitely inappropriate for children, you should be watching Eva. Like, now. It's not just good, it's the Anime Lord of the Rings: the genre-defining classic that would forever change everything that came after.
For the record, the suggested way to see the show is to watch the entire series and then End of Evangelion, which takes place concurrently with the last two episodes. Skip Death and Rebirth. There's no reason to watch it if you've seen the show. I've heard rumors that Netflix's dub isn't up to scratch, but the "subtitles" option is right there, so I can't really complain. Probably better than the 90s dub either way...
The only real complaint I have about this release is that it seems Netflix couldn't license the original ending theme, an absolutely excellent rendition of Fly Me To The Moon. Not that the music they use instead is bad, but... well, it doesn't compare. Ah well.
Anyways, I'm just really really really excited. Mostly to see everyone's confused, horrified, and baffled reactions. That will be great.
And by a bit I mean a lot, because this show is great and if you're not watching it you should be.
I just watched episode 18.
All I have to say about it is that Gendo Ikari is probably the Antichrist if not the Devil himself, and he needs to go take the Spear of Longinus up the die in a fire. RAH. }= <
~Neshomeh
I knew you'd get into it.
As for Gendo... well... uh... yeah.
My brain has melted out through my ears. The hype is real. Up is down, black is white, clockwise is widdershins, and my brain is full of frell.
And there are still two more episodes! But Phobos says there's no point in watching them. We might just go straight to End of Evangelion. But, then again, who knows? It's entirely possible none of this is real anyway! {= D
~Neshomeh
Both and of Eva and those last two episodes occur concurrently (well, the episodes occur within End of Eva, sorta... you'll understand later), and you shouldn't skip them. They're really important.
And yes, that is addressed to both of you, because I know how Phobos was going to respond if he'd had time this morning, and I don't want a fight. {= \ You've each clearly had very different experiences of this show, but different opinions and subjective individual experiences are allowed. Please compare and contrast without devaluing them.
And warn if you start talking about spoilers before I'm done. {; )
~Neshomh
I just think that those episodes are really worth seeing.
I do understand why people would see it in other ways. They are... polarizing. Personally, I really liked them.
Honestly, I found Evangelion a bit weird when it came to mecha shows. I don't think I got past episode six or seven, although it's been a couple of years since my initial attempt. I do remember that the biological mechs (I'm unsure whether that cropped up in the first six episodes, or whether I did the naughty thing and just read spoilers at some point) were a idea that I didn't like, and still don't like. I mean, what's the point in dressing up these alien lifeforms as giant mecha if they aren't actually mechs? It's a cheap way of making a mech, and I will stick rigidly to my mechanical mecha. I mean, the same applies for biological starships (or in the case of Scott Westerfeld's Leviathan trilogy, airships). They're just weird, and I detest them.
These episodes are titled "Rei I" and "Rei II." I guess we're going to learn something about her in this arc, so I'll have to stop calling her Listless Waif and start calling her Rei now. {= P
Spoilers start here.
We do, in fact, learn some things about Rei in this arc. Firstly that there is very little to know: she has no past that anyone knows about, including her. At one point she tells Shinji that she pilots her Eva, Unit 00, because it's her only connection to the world.
It shows, too. Shinji might be bad at peopling, but Rei is worse. She strikes me as being somewhere on the autism spectrum, actually. Her feelings aren't obvious on the surface, and she's aware that she doesn't know how to behave in certain situations. But that's getting ahead a bit.
We open episode 5 with a flashback to the start-up test with Unit 00 that left her so badly injured when we met her. She doesn't sync with her Eva as well as Shinji does with Unit 01, and when synchronization fails, Unit 00 flips out and starts trying to tear the place apart. It's okay, though, because Hard Bastard is there watching, and he stops the giant robot's fists with his face! {= D
Actually, we also learn something about Hard Bastard in these episodes: he is, in fact, capable of human emotion, and he seems to care about Rei a lot. When Unit 00 is finally subdued and the pilot capsule is ejected, blazingly overheated, he runs down and pries the hatch open with his bare hands, burning them in the process, to get Rei out.
And Rei seems to like him, too. His glasses fall off and break in the process. She keeps them, and carries them with her like a good luck charm. Rei slaps Shinji when he tells her of course he has no faith in his father's work, with a father like that. They smile when they talk to each other, these two characters who have not yet been shown to smile and rarely do so, ever.
Huh. So that's... huh.
Shiji, having observed them talking and smiling together, is just as extremely baffled by this as I am. It's a really brilliant scene, with no words required to get the point across. The show is good at this, when it doesn't go on forever.
Shinji is now curious about Rei, and so are his friends Tracksuit and Glasses Nerd. Tracksuit is more about ogling her, though, and Shinji isn't looking at her like that. He's just wondering why she's alone all the time.
Labcoat (who has an impact on the plot in this arc!) gives Shinji an excuse to go talk to her by giving him Rei's new NERV access card to deliver to her. Her apartment is in a crappy area, and she doesn't seem to bother with taking care of it, or even locking the door. I guess she has other priorities; can't blame her. Shinji gets no answer when he calls out to see if anyone is home, so he goes in, and we get an interesting scene of social awkwardness when she suddenly steps out of the shower.
Now, in a lot of animes, this would be purely for lulz and fanservice, but here, it's character development. We get the bit you'd expect, where all the awkward flailing on Shinji's part leads to the pair of them collapsing to the floor with him accidentally touching her breasts. Shinji is horribly embarrassed, but Rei doesn't seem to care or even get why she should. She goes about getting dressed, unbothered. Shinji can't resist peeking at her as she does, but it doesn't come off pervy, IMO--he's not drooling over her, it's just plain curiosity. I don't think Shinji has a sexuality that he is aware of, at least not yet. Rei certainly doesn't.
While Shinji is still not looking, she up and leaves for work. He follows her, and tries a few times to strike up a conversation without much success until he asks her why she's an Eva pilot. She asks him whether he has any faith at all in his father's work, see above for how that goes.
We end episode 5 with Shinji watching her interact with his father as they're loading into their capsules, and the stunned look on his face. Beautiful.
This time, our Angel attack mostly takes place in the second half of the arc, and this one is pretty different from the others. Rather than being a recognizable humanoid or animal-like shape, this one is a simple octahedron determined to DESTROY THEM WITH LASERS. It beats the crap out of Unit 01 without even trying, and Shinji can't shoot it back because of an extremely powerful energy shield. Shinji is nearly boiled alive in his capsule, but they get him out, and he's more or less okay.
They also succeed in loading Rei into Unit 00 and booting it up without any trouble.
This is good, because they need both pilots to pull off the insane plan that Irresponsible Woman comes up with in order to stop this Angel. First, they need an untested, extremely large positron cannon (IIRC, no promises) that they requisition from the armed forces. Then, they need to load it up with all the power from the entire country of Japan. Then, they need Shinji and Unit 01 to precisely aim this thing at the Angel, taking into account such details as the rotation of the fricking planet. And finally, they need Unit 00 to carry an enormous shield made of, like, an old stealth jet or something, I'm not totally sure of the technobabble—just in case he misses and the Angel tries to melt his face again.
Well, long story short, this actually works, and the day is saved. Rei does almost die again in the process, though, and this time it's Shinji who pries her out of her capsule with his bare hands. They have a moment, and it seems like they might become friends after all. Awww, socially awkward nerds in love, maybe eventually! ^_^
That's all I have to say about that. I really liked these two episodes, and I'm looking forward to more.
~Neshomeh
But I've got nothing to add. You said it all. :-)
It looks like we may be settling into a pattern of giant robot fights every odd episode, unpacking the fallout from the giant robot fight every even episode. That's cool. I can dig it.
Spoilers start now.
In episode three, we learn that Hapless Youth still has to go to school, Eva pilot or not. We learn some of the world's history: in an event known as the Second Impact, the South Pole was basically vaporized, sea levels rose, and half the life on Earth was wiped out. This took place in the year 2000, and fifteen years later, humanity has made an astounding comeback. Or, at least Japan has. We don't know anything about the rest of the world. The Rainbow Council may be world leaders, or it may be all Japanese, I dunno. In this episode, we also learn that the government routinely hides things from the people, so it's entirely possible that anything we THINK we know is wrong. This should be fun.
It is relevant to note here that Hapless Youth is fourteen years old. So is Listless Waif. At one point, one of the NERV people makes a telling remark that the Evas must be piloted by fourteen-year-olds. I believe this is because they must be piloted by the "Children." Hapless Youth definitely is a Children (that's how they use the word, don't ask me why); they say so in the first couple eps. Listless Waif likely is, too. In fact, they are two of at least four Children: someone at NERV mentions that they haven't found the fourth one yet.
Undoubtedly connected, when this episode's Angel turns up, a data readout on it labels it Angel 04. There's clearly a link between the Second Impact, the Angels, the Children, and the Evas, though the exact nature of it is unclear so far. What IS clear is that numbers are important, and worth paying attention to as we go on.
But in the meantime, we meet two of Hapless Youth's new classmates, Tracksuit and Glasses Nerd. Tracksuit has a younger sister who was injured by falling debris during the first episode's battle, and he wants nothing more than to punch the Eva pilot in the face for being so reckless. Naturally, when some other students ask Hapless Youth whether he is the Eva pilot, he says yes. Then everyone knows, and Tracksuit punches him in the face. Like you do.
Duty calls when Angel 04 attacks, though. All the students head for their designated shelter, and Hapless Youth and Listless Waif head for NERV. Hapless Youth suits up, despite not caring for his lot at all, and the battle commences.
Meanwhile, Glasses Nerd really really wants to get some video footage of the Angel and the Evangelion. He's sick of not being allowed to see anything. He convinces Tracksuit to sneak up to the surface with him. Almost immediately, they are in peril and almost get squashed by Unit 01 when the Angel slams it into the ground. Oops.
Important fact about Evas: they work best when plugged in, like a vacuum cleaner. They have backup batteries, which are good for about five minutes. Unit 01's cord was broken.
Irresponsible Woman (Hapless Youth's "operational commander," IIRC) orders that Unit 01's power jack thingy be ejected, making space for the two idiots to climb inside to safety. She orders Hapless Youth to disengage, but instead he flips out and starts beating on the Angel with his last five minutes of power. Lucky for him, he stabs it in the eye and it dies just in time. He melts down, witnessed by Tracksuit and Glasses Nerd.
Tracksuit now feels bad about punching him in the face, but Hapless Youth isn't at school the next day. He's taken off. We spend a lot of episode 4 following him riding his midnight train going anywhere, and then following him back to Tokyo 3 on foot for some reason.
I don't think I've actually mentioned Tokyo 3 yet. It's the city where the show takes place. During Angel attacks, the tallest buildings, containing the shelters, are retracted underground, and they hang there, above the NERV command center (I think). It's really pretty cool, and an incredible technological feat for humans to have pulled off a mere 15 years after near annihilation. I don't know what happened to Tokyo 2, but until further notice I shall assume it's hanging out with Babylon 4 somewhere. ^_~
Where were we?
Right, Hapless Youth goes walkabout. Can't blame him, really. He's traumatized, he has no meaningful connections to the world, he has no good role model for making any, and he has no real reason to fight. He protects people who need it when they're right in front of him, but he's only fourteen; he can't really conceive of the big picture here, and doesn't have all the information anyway. He's just done what he's told so far because, well, what else is he going to do?
When he comes back after two days, Irresponsible Woman rags on him about mindlessly agreeing with everything she says without really listening to her. If you don't want to be here, she tells him, you should leave.
Shockingly, he decides to leave. Who would've guessed? So, he's decommissioned, and he gets all set to go back where he came from.
At about this point, though, Tracksuit and Glasses Nerd catch up to him. Tracksuit insists that Hapless Youth needs to punch him in the face to make up for earlier. Hapless Youth does so. They are bros now.
This is probably why Hapless Youth doesn't go through with leaving. He doesn't get on his train. When Irresponsible Woman figures out that he can't form a meaningful connection with her or anyone else because he doesn't know how (how could he, with Hard Bastard for a father?), and races off to try to stop him from leaving, she finds him standing on the platform. There is an awkwardly long shot of the two of them just standing there, staring.
And that's pretty much it.
As of now, I don't really understand all the hate in the fandom for Shinji. The people I know talk about him like he's this useless, spineless loser, and I mean, okay, he's not gung-ho with the fighting, and I guess if you're like Glasses Nerd and you think piloting an Eva would be really cool, I can see why you'd think that. But he's just a fourteen-year-old kid with no real family or friends, no connection to the world, no reason to care, no model for how to care if he wanted to. He's been dragged into this fight with no say in the matter by a father who doesn't love him and a strange woman who's an absolute authority figure on the one hand and trying to be his friend, maybe, on the other. It's confusing. Of course he doesn't know how to handle it. He's barely even aware of what's going on, let alone why or what it has to do with him.
I say, if Glasses Nerd thinks being a pilot is so cool, they should let him try. Except he's not a Children, so it probably wouldn't work. He's probably better off continuing to try and make friends with Shinji. I guess Glasses Nerd is sans parents, too, so they have some baggage in common that will help them relate.
Shinji will probably get called Shinji from now on. I'm starting to know him. I remember Irresponsible Woman's name, too (it's Misato), but I don't care yet.
There's another probably-important female character in NERV, too, some sort of scientist, but I still have no idea what her deal is. The only thing that's stuck with me about her is the scene from ep 1 when she was introduced, and that's only because it involved some pointless fanservice with a wetsuit. If I ever actually feel it's relevant to mention her, she will be Labcoat, because that's what she's worn since, and she IS a scientist of some sort. I'm just not exactly sure what sort.
~Neshomeh
Awkward Silence returns! That's a running theme, like I said.
Regarding both the angel fight and Shinji getting beat up, they both show aspects of something Eva does that a lot of mech series don't so much: create a sense that there are actual consequences. When a building falls down, people get hurt. Our giant robots draw a stupid amount of power: of course we can't just have them run except off a cable. And so on. It makes the world feel more weighty.
The "Children" thing is a preservation of an error in the original. The old sub (and I believe the old dub) said "Child" there, which Word Of God confirms is correct.
As for Shinji Hate, I've actually not seen that so much among people who like EVA. Is that a thing? It seems understand the way Shinji works, so I doubt you'll hate him.
Note: I have never seen this show before, but I have spent a lot of time with people who have. Spoilers beyond the first two episodes may or may not be present in the following summation, I have no idea, but fair warning in case something I propose as a wild guess is actually true. (And please don't tell me either way.)
My summary:
An Irresponsible Woman drives recklessly through an abandoned city, in lockdown due to an attack by a monstrous being called an Angel. One of these hasn't been seen in fifteen years (and the current year is 2015, lol). She picks up a Hapless Youth from a street corner. They are nearly wrecked by the explosion of a weapon meant to take out the Angel, but it's okay: our Hapless Youth's head is cushioned from the blow by the Irresponsible Woman's pillowy bosom. They're both fine, and they make their way to their destination.
It seems the Hapless Youth has been summoned to an underground military establishment known as NERV, which is tasked with fighting the Angels. The summons comes directly from its leader, his father, who is such a Hard Bastard that he can break an I-beam with his face. No, really, that actually happens at one point! Okay, there was reinforced glass in between, but they framed the scene to look that way, so I'll interpret it that way if I want to. {= P
Hard Bastard wants Hapless Youth to pilot a giant robot, or Evangelion, known as Unit 01. The Evas are totally not actually Angels that have been hacked by NERV and encased in armor, I'm pretty sure. Hapless Youth, disappointed that his father didn't actually want to see him out of love or anything like that, refuses. He just got here, he's never seen any of this before, and why should he? Hapless Youth is absolutely correct in this. Irresponsible Woman and Hard Bastard don't try to force him, they just summon the other pilot, who is a Listless Waif due to being more or less on death's door from her last attempt to do this.
By the way, the success rate of the Evas is zero. This has never worked, ever. And yet they still want to chuck Hapless Youth into this thing and expect him to just agree out of patriotism or something, even though he's like twelve, probably. This is insane.
Still, seeing Listless Waif attempt to drag her broken self back into the Eva, Hapless Youth has second thoughts. Also, the battle going on above-ground causes some structural damage down where they are, and some debris nearly squashes Hapless Youth, but the Eva acts of its own accord to protect him, flinging the debris aside to break on Hard Bastard's face. The Eva should not be able to do this, it's not even plugged in. This is Significant.
So Hapless Youth eventually climbs in, and we have evidence that in the 90s, people totally believed that liquid oxygen was going to be a thing by 2015. Hee.
Hapless Youth syncs up perfectly with the Eva. This has never happened before! Amazing! They shoot him to the surface to fight the Angel, and things look promising: the Eva walks! Incredible!
... Then it faceplants and the Angel shoots it in the head. Oops. I guess that's... the end of Evangelion. {= D
No? There's more? Okay.
So Hapless Youth doesn't actually die. In fact, in flashbacks, we learn that the Eva more or less comes to life, heals itself, and proceeds to beat the snot out of the Angel. Hapless Youth is totally fine, if somewhat traumatized. He's given quarters in NERV, but rather than make him live alone, Irresponsible Woman decides to take him in. She likes beer. She drinks beer. She may have had one or two dozen beers. She is also totally manipulating Hapless Youth to be sure he'll be combat-ready again. Nice.
Meanwhile, we see that the world is run by a council of totally-not-evil dudes who all look more or less like the Penguin. (The DC villain, not the actual hyperintelligent penguin Pen-Pen who also lives with Irresponsible Woman and Hapless Youth for some reason.) I'd call them a shadowy council, except they each get their own color spotlight, so they are the Rainbow Council. I'm sure they're not somehow responsible for everything that's wrong with the world.
And that's pretty much it for the first two episodes.
What do I think? It's weird, I don't know any of these characters well enough to care about what's happening to them, and I don't know why the show dives right in and expects me to be invested. Still, the designs are cool, the soundtrack is good (if lined up rather oddly with the action at times), the action is good, and the mystery of what the Angels are, where they came from, what's NERV really all about, etc., is intriguing. So, sure, why not?
I expect some super-weird weirdness going forward, though. So far, I'm not feeling it, and the hype is large. {= )
I'll try to give more thoughts as I go, but no promises I'll be very consistent about it.
~Neshomeh
I'll reiterate that you should definitely watch Subbed, but other than that... uh... yeah. That sounds like the first two episodes of Eva.
I actually really liked Episode 2, and thought it sold the show well. But I think I'm in the minority on that.
As for the weird stuff... it takes a while. That largely comes in at the very end of the series. Until then, you'll be seeing a lot of standard giant robot stuff, execept with characters that are less stable than usual.
The one thing I want to point out as something I especially like is the sound design. Those quiet, still shots that show up in almost every episode (you probably know the ones I mean if you've seen the show) do a lot to build the oppressive atmosphere this show thrives on.
The dub is the same one he's familiar with, so we're sticking with it. Plus, I'm familiar with the Eva soundtrack and all bajillion versions of "Fly Me to the Moon" that come with it, so if I don't have to listen to it ever again, I'm okay with that. ^_^;
~Neshomeh
Netflix did a totally new dub for the series.
Why would they go to the trouble to re-dub it and still make it sound like an aging VCR chewing on a Tomagotchi? I guess they were trying to make it as close to the original as possible.
I will admit to watching the entire series, plus Death And Rebirth and End of Evangelion, in the span of a single weekend in 2005-ish, so maybe I just don't remember. That weekend...maybe I don't want to remember...
-Phobos
I gather that the translation in this dub is closer to the original Japanese, which is overall a good thing, but people are pretty ticked about some of the changes. On the one hand, making a thing more nuanced and less blatant may be a more faithful translation, but on the other hand, isn't the purpose of a good dub to carry the intended meaning across to the intended audience? Americans aren't that good at subtle and nuanced, by and large, and I guess there's one scene that changes one male character saying the following to another male character: "you are worthy of love ... it means I love you" to "you are worthy of my grace ... it means I like you," which doesn't look especially good even if it wasn't done maliciously. And I agree with the article writer: what does "grace" even mean in this context? I can see why the other points they mention are irritating and even stupid, too.
However, as someone with no attachment to the ADV dub and with the ability to read nuance and subtext, I don't think I'll mind too much. I have noticed one or two spots where the emotion of the voice acting doesn't quite seem to match the emotion of the animation, but nothing too egregious so far.
~Neshomeh
And if you don't actually get what's happening there because of the alteration, that actually is a problem. I mean, given what else happens it should be obvious, but still.