Subject: Re: If what I've heard about 4chan is correct...
Author:
Posted on: 2008-10-21 22:57:00 UTC
4chan isn't that bad, as long as you avoid certain sections of it. Sure arguments can get heated and people get insulted, but it's no worse than some other areas of the internet.
Of course I mostly stick around /m/ and /y/. I'm a bit wary of stepping into /a/. That's supposedly where the worst of the crazies hang out.
Some idiot has signed me up for two hundred unwanted Neopets accounts and is using obscene language on them. Something's wrong with the login so I can't log into them and delete them, the Help FAQs won't let you read them unless you're logged in, and the email forms with which you're supposed to ask for help don't cover this situation.
This has happened before so I want to actually get the police involved now. Does anyone know where I can report it?
Did I get 'him? Did I get 'im? No? Drat. Someone fetch my trollspray!
And what's a lulzcow? Is it the feminine version of the Ypur?
A lulzcow is someone considered excellent entertainment by the nameless hordes of the internet.
The best thing when being attacked like this is to hide and cut your losses. Doing anything otherwise might lead to this happening:
http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Poeticirony(NSFW just for the pictures)
http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Goddessmine (also NSFW)
Learn from their failings. Because if you don't, this little internet feud might become lulzy enough to spillover into real life. Look up the Subeta raids, and what happens when people take trolls like goatse boy and sovietbarney too seriously. They get trolled harder, and worse.
Don't be another entry on ED, let the wave wash over you and stand up when it passes. See ya,
Fichunter
If you do not cease and desist this behaviour, I will report it to your service provider. If any "trolling" attempts occur, I will go to the police immediately.
Laburnum, I'm glad you're feeling confident in the whole 'oh look I can get actual help from the authorities for this!' but we really don't need to let this get out of control.
And Fichunter, maybe the PPC isn't the best environment for you on the net. There's obviously a large personality clash here going on which ain't being helped by your total disregard for the Rules of the Board and your total lack of respect for others here. This isn't 4han, so stop treating it like every rule of the internet applies here. Like I said, if you can't go along with the rules of the game here, GTFO.
Stick to /b/ and /v/ maybe, since anon definitely goes better with your personality type.
That said, I am so not impressed by some of the replies here. Like Neshomeh said, let's keep it cool, yeah?
Will try to make sure I don't do that again. Sometimes my mouth (or keyboard) runs away with me.
(the reliability of which I know nothing about - I googled)
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=lulzcow
lulzcow
An ass clown. Someone who provides many lulz from their own ridiculousness.
Bill: Did you go to that link I sent you the other day?
Ted: Yeah, that guy was a lulzcow.
To follow the linked references...
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=lulz
lulz
Beginning as a plural variant of lol, Lulz was originally an exclamation but is now often used as a noun meaning interesting or funny internet content.
Lol -> lul; lols -> luls; lolz -> lulz.
Lulz is the one good reason to do anything, from trolling to rape. After every action taken, you must make the epilogic dubious disclaimer: "I did it for the lulz".
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ass%20clown
Ass clown
(ás kloun) n.:
one, who, through the fault of his parents conception, is a skid mark in society's collective underwear.
And from Encylopedia Dramatica...
http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Lol-cow
A lol-cow is a victim of a Flame War who can't help but be milked for lulz time and time again. They have a compulsive need to give up as many laughs as possible at their own expense despite themselves.
So, if I'm reading this right, it means... well, it's certainly not polite.
... for the fact that they suggest the subject has to be funny. I used to think he was basically a decent guy who was just having difficulty getting used to the way we interact here. I guess now we know better, don't we?
The fact that I'm on your side doesn't mean I won't remind you that Da Rules go both ways. He's been roundly censured. Let it go before it escalates into something really nasty.
~Neshomeh
That said, I hold no grudge - against either you or Fichunter.
I happen to be with July here. I'm pretty sure it's in the constitution that interpersonal tiffs will not be tolerated on this Board. Grow up or go away.
~Neshomeh
We don't all have to agree, but there's no call to be rude about it, much less nasty. And that's not just a courtesy; it's in the Board Constitution - first rule, in fact.
If you have good reason for what you say, then say it, in full, without insulting anyone. Copious use of the phrases "I think" and "my opinion" would help. I cannot imagine why you don't sympathise with Laburnum on this matter, but I want to understand people, so if there's a reason, I'm willing to listen. If it's sensible.
If not, don't say anything at all. In case you haven't noticed, people around here tend to stick together; if you insist on setting yourself apart, you're not unlikely to end up with most of the Board against you, and no one wants that to happen.
Please. No one's demanding an apology or banning your opinions, but a potentially rude one-line post on a fairly sensitive subject is just a bad idea.
I think he's walking a thinner and thinner line now.
I think Techno-Dann's the one to ask that question to.
Will ask him when I next see him.
And BTW, Fichunter; tell your buddies that "anonymous" isn't necessarily as anonymous as you think, and that should something like the incident I was talking about happen again (or if my name shows up on Encyclopedia Dramatica or similar sites - I do not care if it's "satire", I could still make a harassment and/or libel case out of it) I will not hesitate to press charges on every person involved. "It's just for the lulz" has the same meaning as Randal Milholland's translation of "the end justifies the means": that is, I quote, "the cowards' way of saying 'I know it's wrong but I did it anyway and I don't want to face the consequences.'"
Did you just write what I thought you did?
Why, yes, it seems you did.
What charming words!
And such acerbic wit!
Once again, speaking only for myself and no one else, and certainly in no official capacity, I highly suggest you stay off this board until you learn to respect others.
Because honestly?
Posting that was dick. Really, it was.
Now, seriously, GTFO until you either learn how to troll better or are willing to actually participate.
I have every right to be angry if someone was performing ILLEGAL ACTIVITY. Did you actually see what he was doing? Sending obscene death and rape threats to twelve-year-old children on ffnet? I think that goes a little beyond a joke.
We alerted his service provider and they've shut down his access. Apparently they caught him doing other illegal things as well. Disappointingly, they aren't legally allowed to tell us who he is or whether they've contacted the cops, but apparently sending this kind of stuff is a federal offence so we're talking FBI here. Yay! (I shouldn't be so happy that I potentially sent someone to jail, but he was sending obscene death threats to twelve-year-old kids on ffnet, so I sincerely hope he suffers in every way that is possible within the extent of the law.) If he shows up again we can report him again, but I doubt he will.
Now that appears to be sorted, could I get in trouble if I wrote a PPC fic where my girls did something insanely unpleasant to someone very similar to this idiot?
Remember to be cooperate with the authorities in any possible way you can (the more you help, the more incriminating evidence the prosecutors will have, the higher likelihood of Sir Trollalot getting thrown in the clink) and to be sure to alert the proper authorities if this ever happens again.
As for the second thing, I personally don't see a problem with it, but it might be stooping a bit to his level, mightn't it?
Don't feel bad about feeling happy; this guy clearly deserved it. And I agree with hS about not writing about this idiot, but that doesn't mean you can't take out your anger in some *cough* creatively violent ways on whatever Sue your agents deal with next. *big smile*
Then have them wake up to discover he's been arrested in the Real World? After all, Trojie did her "personal real-person grudge" thing as an AU.
Besides, can we say we wouldn't want to see this snotrag fed to the Holder of the End, even if it was only a dream? (http://theholders.org - enjoy. Appropriate for Halloween.) Trouble is the only way to get past the Holders is to give them the password and accept the Object, and I think having an agent pair stuck with an object of ultimate evil in their response centre which slowly drives them into the non-useful kind of insanity would be difficult to write around ... Maybe they could sell it on Ebay.
I mean, not that it wouldn't be fun, but no matter how you frame it, that's still about a real person, and whether a PPC mission or not, you don't want to sink that low.
But yes, I see the point. Still may write one and keep it to myself, or possibly write a smug letter to him. He probably wouldn't see it even if I posted it because his net access has been cut and it's not impossible that he's going to be incarcerated fairly soon, but this guy made my life a misery in several tiny ways for years before he did this (he was the idiot who sent the Yiff In Hell spam around the Pit years ago) and I'd like to blow off steam.
Just don't make it literally about him. Find a Stu with resemblances or invent an annoying agent/OFU student/something that bears a striking resemblance, but don't sink so low as to use him directly. You're better than that... and it's safer, just in case he has some really good lawyers.
*hands over a BIG steam-whistle* tug away, dearie.
But I won't have the characters actually hurt him. I just want to get the news out to the guys on the ffnet section that he's gone because he bothered them for years. And I wouldn't mind writing a particularly smug message to him on my LJ, if I can get away with that ...
Might use the Holders for a Sue, but the only way to get past them is to pass the tests to acquire the Object and I don't think objects of ultimate evil are okay to bring into HQ ... ah well.
Any reference to him more direct than "some idiot who's been annoying me" is... well, it jsut doesn't sit well with me. Is your choice, of course.
... I don't know his real name. If I just refer to "that spammer" everyone on ffnet will know which one I mean. He's been bothering the lot of us for a couple of years.
You've closed him down on one front, but if he's really determined, he can come back another way. It's kinda the nature of the internet. On that note, I agree with Sedri that it's probably unwise to do anything that would give him any excuse to go after you again. Note that he's been stopped for now, let everyone feel good about that, but don't stop being cautious.
~Neshomeh
Shame.
Which is that we're against the creations, not the authors. I'm not saying that this person wouldn't deserve it, but the PPC is not the place to do that sort of thing.
hS
... using "abuse@neopets.com". I hope he's not a Neopets team member. Can someone with a Neopets account report this to them for me?
I can't think of any exact sites off the top of my head, but there are sites you can use that will enable you to disguise your email as coming from somewhere else.
Friend of mine tells me that if you've got decent spam protection it'll filter those from popular places out, but it's obviously not the case here.
Quite frankly, it's obvious they're reading the board, which makes soliciting advice out in the open difficult, obviously.
I'm starting to get seriously worried that there might be more than one person involved. What do I do in that case?
Kit and Minty were discussing whether they could get away with putting him in Jackverse Hell. They decided against it, they didn't intend to cause him actual physical harm even within the fictional context, and it was meant solely in a fictional context as a letting-off-steam joke. Would I still get in trouble for that if this did end up in court or something, even if his reaction of death threats is clearly overblown?
These people do this sort of thing because they think the internet is full of idiots and that there is entertainment to be had by jerking the idiots around. I don't know if that is true in your case, but chances are the spammer(s) didn't need much of an excuse to be asshats to begin with. I don't think you're likely to get in trouble for making a joke, but that's because it's so ridiculously hard to prove emotional distress and stuff like that. That's why it's hard to pin down people who perpetrate this kind of harassment. Their argument is, "It's text on a screen. Stop taking the internet so seriously."
My advice is to keep doing what you're doing to stop the harassment, but whatever you do, don't give them the satisfaction of seeing you freak out.
And maybe leave 4chan forever. I mean, why make it easier for people like them to mark you as a target by hanging around?
Again, this all may or may not hold true for your situation. Ultimately, you'll have to use your own judgment. It just comes from stuff I've picked up by reading.
~Neshomeh
... we can just catch them one at a time, so no big deal.
I've never been on 4chan anyway except very briefly to read the Creepypasta and Holders Series, which I found elsewhere as well, so no problem there.
Dad tells me that since we didn't send said comments to him directly and we clearly meant it as blowing-off-steam rather than an attempt to be threatening, we're safe.
4chan isn't that bad, as long as you avoid certain sections of it. Sure arguments can get heated and people get insulted, but it's no worse than some other areas of the internet.
Of course I mostly stick around /m/ and /y/. I'm a bit wary of stepping into /a/. That's supposedly where the worst of the crazies hang out.
I came home to find two hundred identical threatening emails in my inbox. I blocked them, but I'd like to actually take some kind of action against them. My father refuses to believe that we can do anything law-wise. Can I actually report this to the police, and if so should I report it to UK or US police? I don't know which side of the Atlantic the spammer is on. I now have an email address for the spammer, but it's probably just a disposable one.
The section of the act that you should be pursuing in the US, if you charge over there, is section 223 of title 47 in the Communications Decency Act (amended). In particular, you're looking to charge the bastard/bitch under this subparagraph -
"(a) Prohibited general purposes
Whoever-- (1) in interstate or foreign communications--
(C) makes a telephone call or utilizes a telecommunications device, whether or not conversation or communication ensues, without disclosing his identity and with intent to annoy, abuse, threaten, or harass any person at the called number or who receives the communications;"
(NB: subsection (h)(1)(C) of this act states(C) "in the case of subparagraph (C) of subsection (a)(1), [telecommunications device] includes any device or software that can be used to originate telecommunications or other types of communications that are transmitted, in whole or in part, by the Internet (as such term is defined in section 1104 of the Internet Tax Freedom Act (47 U.S.C. 151 note)).")
In the UK, you're looking at the Malicious Communications Act 1988 (amended 2001), which states the following -
"(1) Any person who sends to another person
(a) a letter, electronic communication or article of any description which conveys
(i) a message which is indecent or grossly offensive
(ii) a threat or
(iii) information which is false and known or believed to be false by the sender or
(b) any article or electronic communication which is, in whole or part, of an indecent or grossly offensive nature,
is guilty of an offence if his purpose, or one of his purposes, in sending it is that it should, so far as falling within paragraph (a) or (b) above, cause distress or anxiety to the recipient or to any other person to whom he intends that it or its contents or nature should be communicated."
(The relevant section is section 1, subsection a, paragraph ii.)
So there you go. If you need any other legal advice from a first year Law student who's not been admitted to the bar in his country yet and thus is in no way an expert on foreign legislation, don't hesitate to ask (on the plus side, it's free advice, heh).
There are two different ways to attack this - cut his E-mail account, and cut his web access. The first is more likely, all you should need to do is forward one of the E-mails with an appropriate note added to abuse@ his E-mail provider. They should deal with it quickly.
The second is a bit trickier - you'll need to open up the MIME headers of his E-mail address. Included in the header is a server-by-server list of how the E-mail got from him to you, including all IP addresses involved. The first one on the list should be his. If it's something at yahoo.com or whatever, he's using a webmail client - go back to technique one.
Once you have his IP, it's relatively easy to reverse-DNS it (or whois) and work out at least generally where he is. Unfortunately, laws on cyberstalking vary wildly by state - some have very strict laws, some have no laws at all. You'll have to play that one by ear.
You'll have to open up the MIME headers of his E-mails, not his address. Sorry.
Will update as necessary.
I can't find a suitable place to report it, because what they're sending me isn't technically illegal, just annoying and creepy.
You, or I, if there's an issue, cna use my Neopets account. It's been years since I actually used the thing, but it should be enough to let you report to the Admin of the place.
And if it's making you uncomfortable, and you've asked them to stop, it is illegal. It's mental and emotional abuse, and even if it occurs over a cyber setting, it's still illegal.
http://www.neopets.com/autoform_abuse.phtml?abuse=report
That's the link to report abuse and all that. My username is Articblade, password is Laburnum00. Let me know when you're done, so I can delete the account.
It's the 4chan moron(s) again. I'm also pretty sure that whoever it is is on the other side of the Atlantic from me, so I don't know what I can do.
Cyberstalking and that is covered under local law. If they're in America, they'll be punished under American law. If you have their IP Address, notifying their Internet Provider can help, and if you're serious, they can easily press charges against the person doing so.
And when it comes to the Neopets, inform them of the hijacking of your accounts and what's going on with your email. If you provide the neccesary details, then the Neopets team could probably track the person's IP address the next time they log on to your accounts and ban that IP address from Neopets.
They're just using my email address to make hundreds of the things and flood my inbox with confirmation emails. And I don't have an IP address for the idiot, nor do I know how to get it.
Found a much simpler solution, though; I blocked all Neopets email from even arriving in my inbox. I saved all the ones I received beforehand in case I need them as evidence and my dad complained to the mods. I'd appreciate it if you could complain on my behalf, since I want nothing to do with the site.
... contacting Neopets (possibly from that email address, for verification) and telling them that you will not sign up to their site using that address, and that any requests they get to do so are fraudulent. See if they can do anything about it.
hS, throwing ideas around
The only direct-contact email addresses provided are to ask for employment at Neopets. Otherwise you have to click a button reading "account frozen" or "page not working", and none of them cover this situation, and to use half of them you have to be logged in to an account, which I don't have.
abuse@neopets, webmaster@neopets, and/or admin@neopets should get you a (very serious) bite.