Subject: I'm under the impression...
Author:
Posted on: 2013-09-23 21:24:00 UTC
...that either the PPC needs its own (literal?) checkbox chart for the boarders to peruse or I should refresh my memory since I imagine faintly recalling something like that possibly existing somewhere on the wiki.
If the first case is correct I'll offer what little help I can be of.
Is this acceptable for self-testing?
Is it applicable for testing characters encountered in someone else's fics?
Any idea why these tests rank video game characters so highly? I ran some random ones through just now, and Gordon Freeman scored 53%, John-117 scored 42% (including actions he took in the expanded universe), Pre-Other-M Samus scored 43% (Post-Other-M Samus scored an unbelievable 112%!!), and Jak/Mar scored 45%.
I suspect it's because video games usually aren't fun unless you're more powerful in some way than 90% of the mooks you run into (otherwise the game would be all boss battles, and the pacing would be terrible), and the character is actively being controlled by the player.
In order:
Kirby
Mike Thorton
Fox McCloud
Whoever-else.
The thing with this test is that it detects character traits as opposed to actions.
What I mean by this is that Sir Large McHuge, suave young attractive philanthropist playboy multibillionaire, owner of a multinational high-tech product empire, and secret fighter of crime would be flagged as an enormous Suvian by the test you linked.
I've also described Tony Stark, aka the Iron Man (though my knowledge of the actual character is limited to The Avengers and the first Iron Man movie). Whether he truly is a Stu is hotly contested among certain fans.
However, the test would not catch Snivelly Uselesspants, a totally inept and hideous freak of a human being whose only purpose in life is to whine and complain about being stuck in a rut. That's an Anti-Suvian, and they're just as annoying to read as regular Suvians.
You see, it's about what the writers have their characters do that differentiates between Suvian and non-Suvian. If a character is shown to behave in accordance with his/her established personality, face logical cause-to-effect consequences for his/her actions (be they positive or negative), and experience character growth over a certain period of time (though admittedly difficult for "gag" characters or other one-dimensional types), then they are most likely not a Suvian.
In short, a character needs to be alive as opposed to a walking stack of random traits and clichés bound together by Rule of Cool and wish fulfillment.
...that either the PPC needs its own (literal?) checkbox chart for the boarders to peruse or I should refresh my memory since I imagine faintly recalling something like that possibly existing somewhere on the wiki.
If the first case is correct I'll offer what little help I can be of.
It's currently undergoing renovations at the moment, but here is the most recent version of the article.
The article provides a list of common traits (remember: in-canon context matters!) found in Sues.
I have used that test for characters as a way to try to figure out whether they have too many speshul traits. Cluttering up a character like that makes them (ironically) less interesting, so it can be quite helpful to answer those questions. My characters usually get somewhere from 10-25; the higher-powered characters do test in the low Mary-Sue range; the highest, an Abyssal Exalted character I played in a tabletop game, scored a 28. Exalted has a very high power level, and Abyssals by definition have a tragic past. And yet I don't think he was a Gary Stu. Yeah, he had the big sword and the necromantic power, he did save the world a couple of times, and he did manage to complete a nice little redemption arc (which is near impossible for Abyssals, considering their brains are basically linked to eldritch abominations)... but on the other hand, he started out as honestly cowardly (though he didn't stay that way), spent most of the game looking more like a living mummy than a glamorous vampire, and got manipulated by pretty much every ancient evil in the game until he finally broke free (and died shortly thereafter, because you don't flip the bird to the Neverborn without serious consequences).
So yeah, I think it's a useful tool, but you do have to look at the setting and the character's personality. If you're writing a high-powered character, and the character needs all of those powers to make the story work, you might ping as Mary Sue even though the character is an engaging, interesting character. Some Mary Sues don't show up as Mary Sues on the test simply because they're low-power self-inserts with little personality, who don't disturb the canon much but don't add anything to it either.
In-universe, Mary-Sue litmus tests are represented by litmus paper, which works like ordinary litmus paper except that it measures glitter level instead of pH. It has a tendency to burst into flames when a particularly bad Sue is around, but at least your agents won't destroy yet another CAD.
Most of the half-beast questions, for instance, I would have had to check had I followed the letter of the test, but since my character's at home in the Star Fox verse (where everyone's a furry) I decided to leave them blank.
One question that I still haven't found an answer for is the following: Does the main character's love interest who was rather focal to the plot count as major character if said plot took place in an alternate universe that was abandoned via canon reboot and never mentioned since?
If that is so then yes, my Michael's scheduled for romance with a major character and his sueishness rating will go up a bit (from a current 11-ish.)
Just romancing a character who is no longer around probably doesn't count, provided that said character actually does their own job and was not brought back just to be a love interest.
It would be suish if it seemed like (in or out of universe!) the reason for the LI's return was because (s)he is an LI for Michael (although, as with many Sue behaviors, a competant writer can sometimes get away with it and make it seem at least in character if not outright justified). If the character does other stuff unrelated to that, and is recognized for such, then I'm sure it would be fine.
My attempt involves merging canon lines as the main character changes love interests in between continuities and installments, freeing up his old love interest.
In timeline form: He meets the oldcanon!LI at a point at which he is presumably available in the new continuity. At a much later point - eight years down the timeline - he meets the newcanon!LI and advances on her.
By this I conclude that his previous relationship (the one with the old!LI) must have died a reasonably quiet death (He's The Hero™, so I doubt him being a cheating bastard is plausible), making the old!LI available.
Now introducing the OC to his LI (LO?) is going to be tougher.
I assume that by the time the old!LI discovers that her ex is definitely no longer an option the next major conflict in the new canon line will have broken out and her (very influential) family is once again a target for The Bad Guys.
She and hers are likely to be intercepted near their relatively-backwater homeworld, which is also a place for the peacefully lawless to wait for the heat to die down - a group including my OC team.
Expecting a relatively large amount of money to be gainable by collecting a family of rich industrialists they would keep the attackers occupied, extract the survivors of the crew in order of monetary value and pull out.
Michael then will apply all the tact of a businessman smelling a greater money source just beneath the current spot and offer his team's protective services to a rather relieved family (they were saved from death or assimilation, after all.)
During said mission there slowly but surely grows tension between my OC and his to-be-LI: He was offered good money to keep her safe, and she suffers from a mild form of Leeroy Jenkinson's.
Here is the toughest spot: How do I resolve that tension in a harmonic manner?
Gradually having the two make concessions in the interest of keeping his contract respectively her life, then approaching each other through forced coexistence is my current idea. Execution will be interesting.
TL;DR
Boy meets girl.
Years pass, boy leaves girl.
Boy meets new girl.
Old girl meets new boy under dangerous circumstances.
New boy gets protection contract from old girl's parents.
Old girl hasn't lost her overconfidence, gets in trouble.
New boy hasn't lost the common sense to protect his financial interests.
New boy and old girl are steadily approaching each other's throats in a less-than-kinky fashion.
??? (Profit.
I think that works very well from the Stu/Sue angle. There are a few other things to think of, though, although some of them are fairly elementary.
I'd very much like for the LI character to do other things in between the relationship-building points described here (can't tell if that's already planned). I (and probably most readers) prefer characters who go about their business and develop attatchments to each other on the side, as opposed to the relationship being at the core of the plot. When a character is put in place who does not appear except in their role as LI, that's usually my signal to put the book down.
There's also the damsel-in-distress/faux-action-girl/stay-in-the-kitchen component to keep in mind. It likely won't be obvious since you seem like a competant writer, but if I were writing the story I'd make it an obvious aversion: either she runs off on her own and SUCCEEDS in whatever it was she was doing dispite the risk, or runs into a dangerous situation that even both of them together can't face head on, and while Michael is sensible enough to want to retreat, she's still Leeroying and has to be talked down.
1) Wartime story. There'll always be a lot more important stuff to do than getting together while still leaving enough opportunity to put those in.
Not to mention, there's four other original characters I've put in and I intend them to be more than just setpieces.
Well, one - the half-jerk pilot whose sole reason for desertion in the first place was the better pay freelancing would offer - still needs some working on, think I'll be giving him a family or at least some ethics.
2) In her canonical appearance she was about eighteen, probably had been rushed through pilot training and nepotism'd into the position of Chief Test Pilot at her father's monolithic corporation. First real combat action on the ground: Getting kidnapped and held at gunpoint. In the air? Going up against a cruiser by herself. Result? Reality ensued in both cases, fortunately aid was at hand.
The fic takes place nine years after that. She's probably had plenty of time to practice, however her parents are still likely (and justifiably) displeased by the idea of letting her enter actual combat.
Dangerous situation they can't face head-on without support?
Hmmmm...
Large creature, capable of space travel and ranged attack. Intelligent.
Canonically stated to have nearly completely destroyed an entire fleet seventeen years before the story takes place.
Canonically defeated only by a most excellent pilot aided by his team, all armed with state-of-the-art weaponry.
Speaking of which, said weaponry was developed by the corporation the LI works for. Similar designs were likely also created by the military; it is likely Michael's team is in possession of a few. His piloting skills are entirely simulation-based, however.
One of these creatures should suffice to make the odds seem overwhelming to the realist's eye and challenging to the overconfident. Now I'll have to read up on dogfighting tactics.
As for the success option, let's have her face a wing of assault bombers - their anti-fighter weapons are relatively powerful, but easy to avoid by a skilled pilot. The LI would definitely beat the OC there. He might actually end up getting saved by her instead.