Subject: I think I meant to address Outhra's thing there.
Author:
Posted on: 2013-12-21 06:25:00 UTC
Still, while I dunno if the game itself's still around it's easy to find a good playthrough on youtube. The talk of a normally semi-comic setting going all hardboiled brought it to mind.
(And I know about the influences, we talked about them in IRC. :P )
(Story contains mature language.)
Upon my return, I noticed that a number of AU PPCs had sprung up -- the steampunk AU, the various flavors of bad future AUs, and so on. The overall quality of these settings mixed with my desire to do something new in the PPC has led me to try my hand at creating my own AU.
A bit of forewarning: this is not a happy universe you're about to step into. This is a universe of grime and shadows, of hard men and women in harder times, of cold sweat and hot lead.
This is a story of the Plot Protection Agency.
As always, responses and constructive criticism is appreciated.
Have you ever played Discworld Noir? Obviously, being a Discworld game, it's got more parodic bits, but when I was reading over the story and some of the comments here the it came to mind for getting a noiry feel from a usually lighthearted kind of setting (though, I'll admit, less so in a lot of the more recent books it seems). Though the Vimes books can get a bit hardboiled too.
Anyhow, I know I had my shot when betaing but I'll provide some more concrete feedback in another reply, a lot of things I could say have been said by members of the community smarter than I am. :P
My experience with noir and hardboiled has been more typically straight-laced, apart from the City Watch books. Raymond Chandler, Dashiell Hammett, and so on.
Still, while I dunno if the game itself's still around it's easy to find a good playthrough on youtube. The talk of a normally semi-comic setting going all hardboiled brought it to mind.
(And I know about the influences, we talked about them in IRC. :P )
...I have one criticism of the whole piece. I think you could have gone further with the Noir style. Now, don't get me wrong, the setting and atmosphere were pretty good. It was the style that was a little off.
I felt like you were maybe missing some asides, and the asides you had (like the opening paragraphs) were missing some of the colorful metaphors and similes, all of which are a staple of Noir. I really wanted to get inside Danny's head more.
Other than that, I liked the imagery you used. I could visualize all of this going on in a grainy, black-and-white world. I liked how you handled the Weeds and especially the "badge and gun" bit. That was all classic.
I also think you might have missed an opportunity to make things even more Noir with the portal at the end. A portal the way we think of them in the PPC, is a little out of place. However, office doors are often used in Noir to show entrances and exits. You know the kind I mean; frosted glass with someone's name on the outside. I would have used one of those as the means of entering and exiting the worlds. But that is just me, and a small quibble in the grand scheme of things.
So, to sum up: I like it a lot. You had excellent atmosphere, and a few tweaks to the style would make it even better.
-Phobos
The tone was definitely something I struggled with in places. My very first draft had a lot more mental metaphors, but it started to come off as being a noir parody instead of legitimate noir, so I took a lot of them out. I'll be keeping that in mind when I next write for the PPA.
Gah, I wish I'd thought of the frosted door portals beforehand! I really the idea the more I think about it. Maybe it can come up in some form or fashion later on.
Again, thanks for the comments!
I'd been imagining them as rectangular, and opening with a low creaking sound like rusty hinges instead of the silence or low electronic fizzing noise the PPC portals make. They'd also let in a blast of cold air and a brief flash of light when expanding, referencing the cold and windy mornings in which a noir detective often receives the first visit from his new clients. It invokes some of the frosted-door imagery without actually being a giant door that appears out of nothingness.
I was going to include something to reference how rainy it sometimes gets in noir, but that seems way too many references to just pack into one system, plus, it would probably result in people getting drenched when they walked through portals, and there are only so many snide sarcastic remarks a hard-boiled detective type can make about holes in space that dump water all over your new hat.
To be fair, I was envisioning the New Shade as something more noir-parody myself, especially since my first reaction to this new AU's existence in the ever-growing PPC Multiverse was imagining a New Shade agent meeting up with his Transfictional Canonical Defence Authority counterpart and immediately going on some sort of trans-dimensional buddy-cop journey, so my portal idea might not connect well with what you had in mind for the tone.
Most of what I have to say about the story has already been said, but for one personal response, I really liked this universe's Flowers. Not only getting to actually see some of them, since PPC AUs seem to be averse to that for whatever reason, but how well they transitioned into this. The Flowers' tone of detached, vaguely haughty phrasing fits really well in the setting, and I loved the contrast between it and Danny's blunter attitude. The part where the Sub Rosa makes an offhanded and aloof comment as Danny walks into the room, only for Danny to say "You're in my chair." was one of my favorite exchanges. I'm sort of interested in what the extent of the differences between these Flowers and the main universe Flowers are now.
Also, the fedora-wearing bodyguard Weeds were great. I know there's a noir term for what they are, but the only word I can think of is "kneebreakers", and I know that's not right. It sounds like something that would be part of some sort of malapropistic noir-parody inner narrative, maybe, but not an actual term. Anyway, I liked their inclusion. It both set some differences between the main PPC universe, where the high-ranking Flowers would usually go to these sorts of situations alone and the Flowers would attack telepathically rather than carrying guns, and it provides extra detail for the setting without making those details explicit. There was a sizable amount of low-context world-building in this, actually, which I think makes it a good start for an AU. I'm wondering exactly how noir HQ is going to work, though. Noir detectives are notoriously at their best when walking down some sort of shadowy street in the cold hours, not letting the man following them know that they know he's there, and other situations that are rather solitary in nature. HQ is, by its nature, not very solitary. You can't exactly have everybody going on a dimly-lit trudge through the halls, leaving about twenty feet of space in front of and behind them so everyone else can trudge in their own space, because that would be venturing into parody again.
...a sort of programmable doorknob that can be attached to any surface (or at least, that's what I thought once the idea had been put into my head after the fact). Stick into onto the nearest wall, tree, cliff face, or whatever. Push a few buttons, and boom! Instant door.
There's obviously going to be a bit more cooperation in the PPA than in a typical noir story. Still, I would argue that noir detectives and characters are at their best when interacting with others, be those others partners, clients, contacts, or targets. An over-emphasis on internal monologue runs the risk of falling down the path of parody. Plus, maybe it's just me, but HQ has never seemed like a particularly packed place. I think a large part of that is due to how little most agents seem to interact with others outside of their partner. Outside of the occasional co-write or RP event, the vast majority of partnerships operate in their own little universes.
Minor note: I'm pleased that you picked up on my little pun, albeit not in the way I intended (new shade = darkness = noir). It's not what I'm calling the universe, though. It's the Plot Protection Agency, or PPA.
It's a nice twist on the RA, and a way to make the technology particular to the PPA. Are you planning on doing the same thing with the other typical PPC tech like consoles and CADs?
I've also thought that HQ seems to be a surprisingly empty place most of the time. The thing that struck me most about that is that while some locations always seem to have people in them (such as the cafeteria), agents very rarely seem to encounter anyone else while walking through the corridors. It does make it seem like a fairly desolate place at times.
Yeah though, a lot of stories don't really give a good sense of scale or of lots of agents all living in the same place. Maybe it'll come across more in future, spotlights on the more social aspects of HQ (Rudi's, the 'Cook, etc.) seem to've been helping. And of course, a big place doesn't necessarily mean everyone's wandering around all at once. :P
Goons, legbreakers, gorillas, thugs... I think the second one's most common. :P
Also, New Shade?
Toughs, muscle, or buttons.
Phobos
It basically means a really low level person. If the boss tells you to "push a button on a guy (aka kill)", you don't ask questions, you just "push a button on a guy".
A button man is just there to make sure the higher ups don't have to push that button personally. Wouldn't want their fingerprints on it, after all.
-Phobos
That's the name I was using for the universe, based on its entry post being called "A new shade of PPC AU". I thought the "New Shade" title was a pun based on the fact that noir often has window shades casting fragmented light, which would be a second definition of shade, on peoples' faces, and so adopted it as a universe-designating name that would be less awkward than "that noir version of the PPC that PoorCynic started working on a while ago". It'll be immediately overwritten once he comes up with something official, of course. This was just for convenience on my part. Categorization and such.
Legbreakers! That's what I was thinking of. Also, "gorillas" is a good term. It's direct, self-explanatory, and mildly insulting at the same time!
New Shade sounds like a story title more than a universe designation, heh. And I know I've seen at least one work use "gorillas", just not sure where.
Funny enough, I'd been thinking on trying a more hardboiled PPC kinda story with my DIA people, but I suppose now that's on the shelf.
That this is fantastic.
This is utterly brilliant.
I wish I had more words to say brilliant,
But instead I'll just stay here sounding like Arthur Shappey on repeat.
The setting is meant to be a noir version of the PPC. Sorry about the lack if clarity.
PC
I was a little thrown at first by the idea of yet another ~*dark*~ PPC story, plus the old "grizzled veteran pulled out of retirement" thing, but since it's noir—and because the writing is just that good—I can forgive that.
I think you've got a great voice for Danny here. His sarcasm is entertaining to read, and it makes the grittiness of his surroundings bearable. You've also got a good balance between description and thought. I had a solid picture of what was going on without ever feeling like I left Danny's head, and I never felt lost in his thoughts, either. I liked the moment where he realizes his cane is missing, and where he remembers the incident that made him leave without feeling the need to spell it out for us right then. It keeps both the mystery and the pacing alive.
It's interesting that the Flowers are explicitly telekinetic in this. I usually just assume they somehow grip stuff with their leaves. I also particularly liked the details of how the Sub Rosa's thoughts feel to Danny.
Good word use in We shall wait out in the other room while you comport yourself. "Comport" is one of those excellent yet underused words, and it's nice to be reminded it exists.
I liked Danny's rant, and I like that he was proud of it. Did he practice that? Unless his saying it was good was sarcasm, but that's fun, too.
I noticed a couple small mistakes:
1. I think you want drunk instead of drank in "Maybe I’d misjudged how much I’d drank last night." He drinks, he drank, he has/had drunk, yes?
2. A missing comma in "'Sounds like things are in a tight spot.' I meant it[,] too."
3. Missing word in Even as [you] slowly drink yourself into oblivion, you still take time to help people.
Oddly enough, Phobos and I have discussed the possibility of a noir-style PPC mission before, but we never got around to it for lack of a badfic in an appropriate setting and the fact that I haven't really read or seen much in the genre and wouldn't be at all confident in that style. I'll be interested to see how you do it.
~Neshomeh
Your compliments are much appreciated, and the errors you pointed out have been addressed. It's much appreciated.
I borrowed the idea of the 'feel' of the Sub Rosa's thoughts from one of Huinesoron's Flower-centric interludes. I really liked the idea of agents having to deal with mental 'tastes' rather than body language or something similar.
I imagine that Danny practiced some version of his rant in his head early one morning while staggering back home from the bar. All the things he'd wished he'd said at the time he'd left and whatnot.
The only badfic I can recall seeing in a vaguely noir setting was some Who Framed Roger Rabbit lemon where the authorial insert character was paired up with Jessica Rabbit. That was a long time ago, though. I'll probably end up just making up some appropriate noir badfic if I want to make an actual PPAverse mission.