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So, can it be done? As Nesh presents, yes, it's possible that Magnus and Ahriman might manage it.

However, there are other options: a popular choice is soulbonding Magnus &c to the Emperor, the same way Navigators work, and turning them into Blind Psychic Monks. This is the route taken by Dornian Heresy, and a number of other Loyalist!Sons AUs. Conceptually, it's... pretty awesome. But if the TS go independent, it's obviously non-viable.

Another choice is to try and get the Eldar to help, although I dunno enough about them to know what they'd do.

And finally, they could try to stick it out. The Flesh-Change can be resisted. It's just extremely hard, and takes immense force of will.

All of these are interesting choices, although I dunno how well any one of them would work.

A lot of it has little to no melodic interest, and there's a good deal of it that's rather peaceful in nature. And it's cool music in general. Check Syrsa out on YouTube. Please?

-Twistey, who's been a fan of the channel for a while

I'll give you something instead.

-Twistey

BC if this is during the 41st Millennium, then the Tau seem like the perfect allies for the Independent faction. The rigidity of Tau castes and their ideas of "a place for everyone and everyone in their place" seems like a very good fit with the organizational philosophy of the Legions, and it also gives them a serious amount of additional firepower. Consider: Terminator armour with Battlesuit mods and weapon systems, and vice versa.

also the standard longarm of the independent legions would then prolly be the burst cannon instead of the bolter and that is some serious upgunning right there

The Independents have all three founding members of the Librarius. I don't think he'd be too happy on their side, either.

~Neshomeh

This might be because they're the Legion I've been actively trying to understand the most (can't imagine why!), but consider:

Of the Legions the Chaos Gods most fear, the Thousand Sons are one, and the Space Wolves are the other; Chaos would have loved for them to wipe each other out at Prospero. Since that doesn't happen, both Legions are still in play, and at full strength.

So, the Indys have what is possibly the most potent weapon against the powers of the Warp on their side. If the rest of the Librarius can reinforce Ahriman's doctrine of "Marines first, psykers second" and impose some restraint on them, that's a force of extremely powerful and disciplined psykers ready and willing to kick in the teeth of anything Chaos-related that comes at them.

Furthermore, Magnus knows about the Webway—he discovered a way into it on Aghoru, well before Nikaea. Not as much as the Emperor, but enough to give the Indys a leg-up on dealing with it when it becomes a problem, especially if the Eldar are on board, too. I think that's likely, since the Eldar did try several times to warn the Imperium about what was coming. If their overtures to Vulkan still happen, there's a chance he actually listens and tells the others about it.

The problem is the fact that Magnus already made a deal with Tzeentch to stave off the Flesh Change, and Tzeentch will call in that debt at some point. Assuming Magnus refuses to give up his soul or those of his sons to Chaos, since he isn't pushed to the literal breaking point here, the Legion is in trouble again—but I'm thinking it might just be possible to actually do something about it in the Curzeline. Ahriman's efforts to stop the Flesh Change are doomed in the Primeline for myriad reasons, but supposing he and Magnus actually work together, with help from the rest of the Librarius, and maybe the Eldar? Maybe there's a way to make it work.

Or, worst-case scenario, some version of the Rubric still happens and most of the Legion ends up as automata. They're still a potent force to be reckoned with.

... Actually, a worster-case scenario might be they have to do what the Emperor's Children originally did to "fix" their own gene-seed problem and cull everyone who's affected. This is a terrible plan that I don't think Magnus (or Ahriman, or the other captains) would ever go for, but OTOH, if everyone else decides that's the only way the faction survives, you've got Curze and probably Perturabo, perfectly willing to wield the axe.

I'm out of time to go further, but another thing Phobos and I started talking about last night: What about the Mechanicum? How does that shake out?

~Neshomeh

As many of you know, thanks to the Internet, my music tastes are all over the place. I just finished letting the recommended videos take me through meme edits, Vangelis, the Crypt of the NecroDancer soundtrack, the Just Shapes and Beats soundtrack, the Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Focus, and more. I love music a lot, and now that the end of the semester is approaching, I find myself studying more and more, with music, of course. Here are a few things I've found out through experience (these may partially just be me, but who knows):

- Don't play it so loud that you have hearing damage. We all know that. But also don't play so loud that the music takes over your thoughts. You need to be able to focus on studying.
- Ideally, listen to something that's relatively fast (it makes you move faster), but not too fast or too hyper, or else you're getting yourself way hyped up.
- Don't listen to songs you haven't heard before. You'll spend too many mental cycles reacting to the song.
- Don't listen to songs with lyrics, or else you'll focus on the lyrics.
- Don't listen to songs that you strongly associate with visual imagery (AMVs, games with synchronized animation, Christmas lights displays, etc.) or else you'll get that image stuck in your head.

So far, "Echoes" by Vangelis has been the best for studying in this particular run-through.

What are your thoughts about studying with music? Do you do it? What do you like to listen to for studying? Any study tips in general? I'd love to hear them!

-Twistey

Or should I?

Monika

It's a zip file. My gift is a piece of software. I really hope it's another game development tool.

-Twistey

He had to be tricked into joining Chaos. I'd say he joins the third faction due to his hatred of all things Warp.

Incoherency is squick by itself. Double the squick!

Not having Magnus contact the Emperor means the Webway Project remains viable and not full of Tzeentchian daemons. That gives the Emperor a massive advantage.
Also, having the Emperor live to see that is huge. Having all those sons fall to Chaos should teach him humility and he will be a better father to his sons.

With that wisdom borne from regret, he would reach out to the Independent faction. They wouldn't remain Independent for long.

I'm going to throw out possible outcomes for non-Astartes factions.

Inquisition - still exists, but it's drastically different and more effective than its Prime-line counterpart.

Ecclesiarchy - doesn't exist. The Emperor insists on not being worshipped like a god. It helps that it becomes public that the Lectitio Divinitatus was written by Lorgar. I don't know if several forces related to the Ecclesiarchy (specifically the Sisters of Battle) will exist regardless, as the whole Goge Vandire and the Age of Apostasy events won't happen.

AdMech - under the Emperor's guidance, the Men of Iron debacle doesn't happen. Therefore, and with more of the Imperium not being ravaged by the Heresy as it was in Prime-line to support their activities, technological progress and STC finding is much faster. True AI constructs are still rare but they're harder to corrupt.

Imperial Guard - knowing that the Emperor is still alive and fighting at their side should prove a major morale boost. The Great Crusade should begin anew and more worlds join the Imperium.

Tyranids - the Pharos debacle doesn't happen so they aren't called in. That's a HUGE thing the Imperium doesn't have to fight.

Orks - the Beast WAAAGH! still happens but it's much better managed, with the Emperor and the Primarchs running things instead of a bunch of incompetent High Lords. Damages and casualties are still severe but not nearly as much as Prime-line demanded. Ullanor is destroyed and spoilers regarding that planet and a certain Ork never happen. The Ork threat beyond that becomes a lot more manageable to the Imperium.

Eldar (of all flavors) - they're still around, and they're still a threat. The Emperor might try to strike deals with them, citing Chaos as the common enemy, but the Eldar will either refuse, citing all those Traitor Legions boosting the Chaotic forces, or reluctanctly agree to the Emperor's deals. If there's any sort of alliance, it will be on shaky grounds and both sides will have detractors.
The Dark Eldar and Harlequins will of course not care. Nothing the Imperium can do will stop Slaanesh's predation on their souls or the Great Dance.


Tau - they're an interesting case. With an Imperium more open to diplomacy instead of "shoot first, shoot second and keep shooting" something good might come of this. Best case scenario, they're accepted amongst the Imperium as some abhuman species. Worst case scenario, Damocles happens but it's much better managed and without HF Behemoth to recall all those Imperium forces the Tau are completely destroyed.

Necrons - as with the Eldar, some deals might be struck with the Imperium with Chaos as the greater enemy. Likewise, they're still a threat.

Your first concern is, I feel, mitigated somewhat by the other members of the Independents. The Khan and Sanguinius both preach restraint on the topic of psycher abilities. Curze and Sanguinius are also turning their powered up eyes toward the future, which may lead to stronger warnings for Magnus.

However, if the Thousand Sons and Alpha Legion are cankers in their alliances, then the Dark Angels are, as well. Nothing in the Curze-line stops the schism in the Dark Angels. So I think there is balance there.

The start of the Ruin Storm was Calth, but it took a full Shadow Crusade to make it the threat that it became. So it will likely be a localized phenomenon unless Lorgar figures out how to power it up.

The Webway might be what finally pushes the Eldar to take a side. If the Emperor can drop a Legion anywhere, then he can drop them into the heart of the Craftworlds.

Interesting point, though, if the Pharos doesn't work out like it does in the Primeline, then potentially the Tyranids never show up. They were originally drawn to this galaxy by the events in the novel "Pharos".

-Phobos

You have him in the third faction, and I think your way of getting him there works, but... by overthrowing the Edict of Nikea, you let the Thousand Sons fall deeper and deeper into psk-craft and the Warp. And the Warp is dangerous. Sooner or later, Magnus is going to touch something that's too much for him to handle, and he's going to be consumed.

If what takes him is of Chaos, and if it's canny enough to not immediately go full Lovecraft, what you end up with is an effective Traitor Legion inside the third faction. If you believe that the Alpha Legion are in some sense still Imperial loyalists, or at least anti-Chaos, two of your three factions have a canker in their hearts. That promises to be an absolute nightmare to sort out.

Second question: it seems moderately likely that the Ruinstorm will still happen (it started at Calth, after all). But with the Emperor and the Astronomican still fully in play, will it be as effective? And even if it is - the Emperor has a functioning Webway portal. If he can learn to navigate it fast enough, he has the ability to drop his loyal legions pretty much anywhere.

Once again, things look pretty bad for the Independents. I think you're right that they need a leg up, but from who? The Cabal wouldn't go for it, I think - they're too tied up with 'humanity must die'. The Eldar... possible. It would lead to a War for the Webway, which means less attention being paid to Horus' faction. That's probably a bad thing, though if there's a reconciliation later (say, after the Indys lose the Thousand Sons to Chaos, and realise this is The Biggest Problem), dropping five legions out of the Webway on top of Horus would make quite a splash.

Who else? Well... if Magnus doesn't fall into Chaos, he seems likely to keep researching, and poking around psyk-active locations. He'd probably go after the Pharos, which means conflict with the Ultramarines. And... is there anything psyker about the Necron?

Come to think of it, it was Magnus who was in favour of learning from Xenos cultures in general, wasn't it? Yeah, I can totally see him poking about in Necron tombs and attempting to Warp-craft himself an 'alliance' with them.

I think that's my answer: the Indys, in rejecting the Emperor, also reject his fear of all things xenos. If the Loyalists represent Humanity, and the Traitors represent Chaos, then the Indys represent Everyone Else. They will use Xenos tech, everything they can get their hands on. And like everything else in 40K, it will come back to bite them, hard.

hS

The Eldar
The problem with the Eldar is that to understand the Eldar, one must first understand the Eldar. The Eldar are a long lived race, their history is shrouded in myth, and no one knows how much truth really lies in the tales of gods and heroes like Isha, Khaine, and Kurnous.
The Eldar claim to have been chose to save the galaxy by the mysterious Old Ones, whose nature is lost to time. The Eldar were given amazing psychic powers and tasked with defeating the C’tan, and pushed them back beyond the Gates of Varl, where they are thought to remain to this day.
The Old Ones disappeared after the war, but the surviving Eldar found themselves in a position of strength. With their new psychic powers and the technology given to them by the Old Ones, they quickly developed a number of colonies throughout the galaxy. The Eldar were able to quickly traverse the galaxy through the Webway, a parallel dimension safer than the Warp. The network of Eldar outposts slowly turned into an interstellar empire, one that came to dominate that galaxy.
With power approaching the godlike, the Eldar lived without disease or war, their every need catered to by their powerful artifice. But the years of plenty took their toll, and their Eldar grew decadent, constantly seeking new pleasures to stave off the crushing ennui brought on by a life without challenge or purpose. The near-religious pursuit of sensation led to strange disturbances in the Warp, a realm that is never truly stable. The chaotic waves of emotion formed into a creature without precedent: the Eldar had made a god of their desire. She Who Thirsts was both the salvation of the Eldar and their undoing, for trillions of Eldar were pulled from the material realm to become Her first daemons, reborn into lives of unchecked emotion.
But some remained. Foreseeing the destruction of their species, Eldar sorcerers built mighty ships called Craftworlds to take the Eldar to the far corners of the galaxy, so that they might survive the coming end. These bands of a few billion Eldar departed to the farthest corners of the galaxy, far from the reach of the coming end. As time went on they traversed the galaxy, seeking some way of rebuilding their old glory. Throughout this trial they were aided by Khaine, the Eldar god of war, who led them into battle against the C’tan so long ago.
Khaine’s reputation had diminished significantly during the years of the Eldar empire, as he existed to lead the Eldar through difficult times that just never came in the days of the Empire, and to guide them in wars that were now a thing of the past. Over time he became a buffoon in the eyes of the Eldar, the foolish twin brother of the king, obsessed with honor and instantly flustered when faced with anything more subtle than a punch to the face. They may not have loved him, but when the Eldar needed him, Khaine was there.
Khaine taught the Eldar the ways of war again, and gave them the power to resist the pull of She Who Thirsts. He forged them into warriors and adventurers, heroes capable of reclaiming the lost Eldar worlds and bringing their people back from the point of extinction. Armed with the technology of the lost empire and psychic powers that beat the C’tan, they pursue their quest without fear, for the worst has already come.
Not all Eldar dwell on the Craftworlds. Some tread the path of the outcast, plying their trade as pirates and mercenaries on the edges of known space. These corsairs, as they are known, represent the majority of the few Eldar seen in Imperial space. They can be seen in small numbers in major Imperial ports, or working as protection for Imperial merchants.
Some Eldar survived the fall without the aid of Khaine. Some far-off colonies never learned of the destruction of their kin, while others survived outside the material realm. Trade outposts in the depths of the Webway provided a safe haven for billions of Eldar, most of them in the seemingly infinite port city of Commorragh. The people of Commorragh are as close to the old Eldar empire as one can find in the present day, reckless hedonism and all. The city is a key stopover for roving Eldar craft, as well as any Imperial ship lucky enough to be equipped with a Webway drive, though visitors should beware the locals, for the ancient criminal Kabals of Commorragh protect their own with great enthusiasm and a deeply held fascination with the misery of others.
Many ask about the Haemonculi, called by some the rightful kings of the Eldar, who dwell in the depths of that storied city. Those who do not learn the truth are happier for it.
The other Eldar of the Webway are the Harlequins, keepers of myth and agents of the Laughing God, Cegorach. It is they who tell the tales of the lost gods, and teach the young to fear She Who Thirsts. It is they who speak of Khaine’s love for his people, and his quest to avenge his fallen brother. Cegorach, for his part, just laughs.
Eldar relations with the Imperium were defined by the agreement set by Farseer Eldrad Ulthran and the Emperor. The Emperor befriended him some time during the Great Crusade, when the Emperor’s fleet made contact with the Eldar in the form of Craftworld Ulthwé. When the Eldar had run into humans before, they found them foolish and insignificant, but when Ulthran met the Emperor the days of the Eldar empire had long passed, and the Eldar of Ulthwé had learned humility in the way only total ruin can teach. The Eldar sent Eldrad as an ambassador to the Humans, and he fought alongside the Emperor for many years. In the later years of the Crusade the Emperor’s duties pulled him back to Terra, and Eldrad rose to take command of his Craftworld. Before they left they made the pact that lives on in legend. As Eldrad said: “Stay the [act of killing one’s sibling] away from us, and we’ll stay the [said noun] away from you.

This is part one of my attempt to make a complete version of Brighthammer 40,000, effectively a mirror-universe version of 40k, an idea which has been floating around the internet in various states of completion. More to come.

The Imperium
Deep in the vaults of the Imperial palace, the Emperor of humanity sits in contemplation. Assured of his greatness by concubines and boot-lickers, but unable to influence the Imperium his is said to rule, he finds himself wondering how this came to be, how a man became a god…
It began with the Warp storms. They brought interstellar travel to a halt, ending the Age of Technology and bringing forth the Age of Strife. It was a time of total chaos, of phosphex and volkite, a time when men were mad and peace was unknown. From all this came the man who would be the Emperor of humanity.
He began his quest as one of Terra’s countless squabbling warlords, just another strongman, albeit a skilled one, directing a band of troops in a constant war for resources and technology. This all changed when he met a man named Malcador, later called the hero. Malcador became good friends with the Emperor, and it was he who suggested the Emperor take on that title. Malcador proved a keen advisor to the Emperor, and together they created a plan not just to conquer Terra, but to rebuild humanity.
With gene manipulation and lost technology, they made warriors to rival any others. Soldiers like the Thunder Warriors and the Five-Two Chiliad, guided by the cunning tactics of the Emperor, made short work of tyrants like the Unspeakable King of Albia, Cardinal Tang, and Narthan Dume (half mad and half genius).
With the lands of Terra united, the Emperor could begin the next phase of the plan he had made with Malcador. This would be the Great Crusade: a quest to rebuild humanity, so that it might live in the light once more. To this end the Emperor started his most ambitious project yet: fatherhood.
The Emperor planned to produce twenty sons through genetic engineering, each with power to rival his own. These would be his Primarchs, and they would lead his legions in the upcoming crusade.
He did this with technology captured from his first extraplantery conquest. The defeat of the gene-cults of Luna and their cybernetic army by the 8th, 13th, and 16th space marine legions allowed him to acquire genetic modification technology, which would facilitate the creation of the Primarchs and the mass-production of space marines.
The Primarchs were made in a secret facility on Luna using all the knowledge the Emperor had at his disposal. But just as he had completed his greatest achievement, hidden forces finally made their move. The Primarchs were scattered across the universe by the strange gods that dwell in the Warp.
Thus the Emperor first learned of the Gods of Chaos, and he had a new task at hand: protect humanity from the perils of the Warp. With this in his mind, continued his Great
Crusade with a heavy heart, knowing that those ruinous powers could strike at any moment. As the Great Crusade continued, and he expanded the domain of humanity through diplomacy and conquest, he began to consider a possibility. His reputation had become nearly mythic, so perhaps he could cement his power by making himself truly mythical: he would be the Emperor of Humanity no longer, he would be the God-Emperor.
Cults in his name having already sprung up all over his domain, all the Emperor had to was continue working miracles. By the time he rediscovered the Primarch Horus Lupercal the Emperor’s divinity was without doubt.
With the Great Crusade well underway and the Primarchs gradually being discovered, the Emperor began to think his work was almost done.
His dream was shattered when Horus turned against him. With half the Space Marine Legions on his side, Horus quickly claimed large portions of the Imperium for himself, culminating in a daring attack on Terra.
The Emperor would have met demise in the battle that followed, if not for the heroism of Sub-Auxilius Ollanius Pius, who went toe-to-toe with Horus himself to prevent him from landing a killing blow on the Emperor. Pius perished at the hands of the Primarch, and reluctantly the Emperor struck dead his own son.
The rebellion dispersed with the death of Horus, as movements based around a single charismatic individual are wont to do. The Emperor continued to rule, but as time went on and his empire grew, ruling his dominion became increasingly difficult. Furthermore, many high ranking officials in the Imperium thought the duties of a common ruler beneath the dignity of a god, so the Emperor delegated some parts of his duty to other people of skill and character, and slowly he found himself being pushed further and further into the background of Imperial politics. The death blow to his reign came when Ecclesiarch Goge Vandire passed a law forbidding mortals from looking upon the Emperor without permission from a High Lord of Terra. To his horror, the Emperor found out that he had lost the power to veto the edict, since he was not technically a member of his own church. To this day he remains sealed in the deepest vaults of the Imperial palace.
… The scraping of the massive doors to his inner sanctum shocks the Emperor out of his reverie. He brushes the hair out of his eyes and peers into the gloom. The figure approaching him is not one of his guards or his counselors, but rather a sword-bearing human clad in blue armor. The figure speaks to him in the voice of a man he thought long dead:
“I think it’s time we had a chat,” the stranger pauses, unsure how to address that Master of Mankind. After a few moments, the newcomer finally speaks:
“Father.”

Alt Heresies are a popular thing in the 40k fandom, so on top of what you've written, Phobos, I may as well take a moment to share some of the other great ones:

The Dornian Heresy is Bolter And Chainsword's shot at a Heresy where the allegiances of every Primarch. So it's the violent traitors Leman Russ and Rogal Dorn and so on. Hence the name. The Roboutian Heresy is another crack at the same idea, which...I confess to not having read. But it's popular...

/tg/ did a trilogy of different heresies, only one making use of the canon primarchs, the other two using an entirely original cast. At least one of them actually uses the "three factions" idea. So that's neat.

And of course, the other alternate heresy: no heresy at all. Warhammer High is a collection of stories from a setting where there was no heresy, and all the primarchs settled down and had daughters who go to school together. I know, it sounds awful, and some of the stories aren't that great. But one particular writer by the name of Someone Else created a quadrilogy of brilliant long-form stories that are, in my opinion, some of the finest the fandom has to offer.

As for your heresy, I think it's viable! more alt heresies are are always fun. Although, of course, I advocate a Magnus-headed 3rd faction. If he could have gotten out of his situation without going Faust, it's quite likely what would have happened.

Warning: The following contains spoilers for the Horus Heresy series of Warhammer 40k novels. If you have not read these novels, go do that. You're only about 50 books behind and should be able to catch up in… 2324-ish? Anyway, you have now been warned and advised, so if you are reading this, I assume you are either caught up or don't care. Either way, on with the show.


So, here's the story for you: When Nesh started reading the Horus Heresy novels she was kind of confused as to how Horus ended up turning against the Emperor. Horus was, as everyone kept saying, the best of the Primarchs. He was everything you could ever want in a leader. But, he was sucker punched by Chaos. Nesh thought that it would be better if Horus were to realize that not only did Chaos suck, but the Emperor was also not that great. He would then break away and form a third faction. This would allow Horus to continue being awesome.

That is not a bad idea on its face, but there is a serious problem: If Horus breaks away, he doesn't form a third faction. He forms a second faction, which will be full of the same malcontents that he drew to his banner in the first place. It changes the course of the timeline, but leads to a very similar place.

But the idea of a third faction that doesn’t support Chaos or the Emperor is a good one. We just need someone else to be the catalyst, and we need it to happen late enough that the Chaos-aligned faction has time to form. First off, we should figure out who is likely to be in which factions. Let's look at the candidates, in numerical order.

Lion El'Johnson - Loyalist, but shady as anything. So many secrets that it wouldn't surprise me if he broke away. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Fulgrim - Chaos-aligned, and massively so. I think it is unlikely that he would turn far enough from that to break out.

Perturabo - Traitor, but not particularly Chaos-aligned. He has grievances with the Emperor and many of his brothers. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Jaghatai - Loyalist, but no one would have put money on that to begin with. He is known for being unknowable. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Leman Russ - Loyalist in the extreme. He is the Emperor's Executioner and is always on his Father's side.

Dorn - Loyal as you can get. Never questions his Father, ever. Not sure he has the imagination to question him.

Kurze - Traitor, but maybe not as evil as he seems at first…? He actively tries to get his brothers to see things as he sees them. He has logical reasons for what he does, even if you disagree with his methods. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Sanguinius - Loyalist, but full of doubts. He sees himself as having defects that the Emperor wouldn't have made purposefully, and he fears the hand of Chaos in his creation. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Ferrus - Loyalist. He violently turns against his closest brother when that brother goes Traitor, so I think he is likely to remain loyal.

Angron - Traitor. Angron has major issues with the Emperor, who he feels is a slaver and a tyrant. He doesn't particularly care about Chaos, he just wants to hit things. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Guilliman - Loyalist… or is he? He did start his own Imperium that one time, so maybe not as loyal as he appears at first glance? Possible candidate to go Independent.

Mortarion - Traitor, but not thrilled about it. He has major issues with both sides of the war. Namely, the fact that both sides are so ready to employ psychic abilities. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Magnus - Traitor, but not by choice. Magnus broke the Edict of Nikea to try and save the Imperium, knowing full well what might happen because of his actions. He was forced out of the Imperium for his loyalty. Possible candidate to go Independent.

Horus - Traitor, because of shenanigans. He was the most loyal. He then became the least loyal once the Ruinous Powers got to him. No going back at this point.

Lorgar - Traitor. He was the first one who wanted to go to the warp. He dove in head first and never looked back.

Vulkan - Loyal. He loves his family. Wants to build bridges, not trenches.

Corvus - Loyal, but mopey. He doesn't seem to have much personality or imagination. I sometimes forget he's there, which is kind of his point, I guess.

Alpharius - Traitor? Probably, but who really knows with these guys. You could tell me that the Alpha Legion backstabbed anyone on this list and I would believe you without question. Possible candidate to go Independent, by default.


So, we have a list. What do we do with it? Do we pick our favorite Potential-Independant Primarch and go from there? Maybe. Or you could do what I did. I let this question stew in the back of my mind for months, reading further books, getting a better picture of the Primarchs. Eventually, during a conversation over breakfast, I had a breakthrough.

Our perfect candidate is Konrad Curze. Now, I know what you're thinking: Curze is a homicidal madman who loves nothing more than to make people suffer. And you're right. However, I would say he is also Batman. He cares deeply about justice, but goes outside the law to dispense it. If that can be tempered, he could be a force for change in the Imperium. The question becomes, how do we temper his more vicious nature?

My theory is that he becomes more and more violent because he has a Cassandra complex. He sees possible futures, but only the worst ones. He tries to tell people, they don't believe him, he becomes more frustrated and angry. He lashes out, creating those terrible futures, to prove to everyone that he is right. They see him as little better than an animal because of the things he does, but never even consider why he does them.

So, what happens if someone believes him? It might look something like this:

Curze-Faction Timeline

Kahraatan - Curze debates Vulkan. Curze says the only way to control the Imperium is through fear; Vulkan says that law will be enough. Curze says he and Vulkan are the same; Vulkan says they couldn't be more different. In the Primeline, they fight and both leave hating the other, with Vulkan reporting the incident back to Dorn and Horus.

In the Curze-line, Curze shares with Vulkan his view that the Emperor is not good; that he is a tyrant and manipulator. Vulkan, being generally open-minded, can see Curze's point about the Imperium-at-large, but cannot let that excuse Curze's indiscriminate killing of anyone who might be evil. This marks a shift in thinking for both Primarchs, somewhat moderating Curze's tactics and changing how Vulkan views the Emperor and the Imperium.

Cheraut - Curze, having confided in Vulkan about the visions that plague him, does not turn to Fulgrim as he did in the Primeline. This prevents Fulgrim from telling Dorn, thereby preventing the confrontation that eventually leads to the destruction of Nostramo by the Night Lords. Nostramo is, rather, put harshly back in line. The guilty are killed, and the society re-ordered, again.

The Angel - Curze, at Vulkan's insistence, reaches out to Sanguinius. They have much in common, including visions of the future. Both see the darkness coming, and determine to stop it. This leads Curze, Sanguinius, and Vulkan to form a secret alliance.

Nikea - The trial of Magnus the Red goes as poorly in this timeline as it did in the Prime-line. Magnus makes for his flagship to go back to Prospero when he is stopped by Sanguinius. The Angel is upset by the whole affair, and knows that his brother is devastated. He offers Magnus council and aid, and hints at the existence of the alliance. Magnus thanks him, but leaves for Prospero all the same.

Davin and Prospero - Horus is wounded and placed in the temple on Davin, opening him to the possibility of Chaos. Magnus, projecting himself from Prospero, attempts to stop his brother from turning to the dark side. He ultimately fails to sway Horus. Upon returning to Prospero, Magnus considers his options and, rather than try to contact the Emperor directly, projects himself to Sanguinius. Sanguinius believes Magnus, for he and Curze have both seen Horus's fate in their visions. Sanguinius tells Magnus about the alliance, and the future that they seek to subvert. Because Magnus never goes to Terra, the Wolves are never sent to Prospero.

Isstvan V - Horus is in open rebellion with the Death Guard, Emperor's Children, and World Eaters behind him. The fleets of the Iron Hands, Raven Guard, Salamanders, Word Bearers, Night Lords, Iron Warriors, Alpha Legion, and Space Wolves are sent to bring him to heel.

After Horus sends word to the hidden Traitor Legions, Curze has a word with Perturabo. Curze approaches his brother as one outsider to another, tells Perturabo that he understands the problems the Lord of Iron has with the Imperium, but that there is another way. Curze wants to see the Iron Warriors become what they were meant to be: not digging trenches, but building marvels. All Perturabo has to do is follow Curze's lead when the time is right.

As the ships of the Retribution Fleet come to Isstvan V and prepare to drop troops, Curze reveals the plot to the wider fleet. Their brothers will turn on them and the Imperium will be in jeopardy. Curze will not play his part and his fleet makes to leave the Isstvan system. Vulkan and Perturabo follow suit, leaving the Word Bearers and Alpha Legion to risk the wrath of three Loyal Legions in the void. The Iron Hands, Raven Guard, and Space Wolves retreat from the system before the four planet-bound Traitor Legions can join the battle in orbit.

Chondax - As the White Scars finish their campaign against the Orks at Chondax, the veil of silence that had blanketed their fleet lifts. They receive reports of Horus turning traitor, of Horus calling for their aid, and of the Trial at Nikea. Unable to determine what is true and what is false, the Khan turns his fleet toward Prospero to get answers from Magnus, with whom he had a surprisingly strong bond. He arrives to find the Blood Angels fleet already in orbit, having never followed orders to go to the Signus Cluster. Jaghatai meets with Sanguinius and Magnus, bringing the three champions of the Librarius together again. They tell him what has transpired and he agrees to join their cause.


The course the war will take from this point remains to be seen. Calth still happens, but will Lorgar and Angron still launch the full Shadow Crusade against Ultramar? Will the Warrior Lodges of the White Scars declare for Horus or remain hidden? There are too many unknowns for one person to contemplate. However, some things are clear:

- Magnus never destroyed the Eternities Gate, so the Emperor does not need to guard it at all times. The Emperor is still in play in this timeline, at least initially

- Ferrus Manus doesn't die at Isstvan. His grudge against Fulgrim lives on.

- Related to the last point, Fulgrim's ascension is now in question. Killing Ferrus gave the daemon in him power enough to take over in the first place. Draining the life from Perturabo fueled his physical transformation. Does any of that still happen? Does he find another way?

- The Shattered Legions are all whole. This means that each of the three factions has six fully capable Legions

- The Thousand Sons are still beholden to Tzeentch and the flesh change. That will have to be reckoned with, one way or another.

- The Loyalists have the Emperor. The Traitors have the Ruinous Powers. Who do the Independents have? An alliance with the Eldar? The Cabal? Someone Else?


We've broken the Legions into three equal factions. Interestingly, these factions all have some things in common. Let's list the Legions in each faction, look at the role they fill in their group, and see what those similarities are.

Loyalists

I. Dark Angels - SWAT, Specialized Wings

VI. Space Wolves - Shock Troops

VII. Imperial Fists - Siegecraft

X. Iron Hands - Specialists, Tech

XIII. Ultramarines - All-Around

XIX. Raven Guard - Recon


Independants

IV. Iron Warriors - Siegecraft

V. White Scars - Recon

VIII. Night Lords - Shock Troops

IX. Blood Angels - All-Around

XV. Thousand Sons - Specialists, Psyker

XVIII. Salamanders - SWAT, Flamers Non-Optional


Chaos

III. Emperor’s Children - SWAT, Noise Marines

XII. World Eaters - Shock Troops

XIV. Death Guard - Siegecraft

XVI. Sons of Horus - All-Around

XVII. Word Bearers - Specialists, Warp

XX. Alpha Legion - Recon


As you can see, each faction has one Legion for each of six roles. Some are better at their roles than others, obviously. For example, the White Scars are the least effective of the three Recon Legions, but they're Rangers, which is a whole different kind of recon than you get from the Rogues that are the Alpha Legion and Raven Guard.

The two roles that need some explaining are SWAT and Specialist. Those are roles that are variable. SWAT is, of course, Special Weapons And Tactics. These three Legions are known for their non-standard weapon loadouts and unusual tactics. Specialists are known for being completely unique in some way. Almost any Legion can have psykers, but only the Thousand Sons have really gone all-in on the idea. The Iron Hands use archaeotech from the Dark Age of Technology that other Legions won't touch. The Word Bearers will touch all sorts of unsavory things that none of the other Legions will.

So, not only is each faction more or less equal in power, they are also balanced strategically. There is nothing that is going to set one faction above the others, with the possible exception of the lack of a god-like figure behind the Independents.


So, what do you think of the Curze-line Heresy? Is it a viable alternative? Is there something I'm missing that makes it untenable? Do you think it would play out differently than I've outlined? Would you build a third faction around a different Primarch?

-Phobos

Though it didn't pan out quite like Ix said.

The Sues were actually from different stories, and the agents on different missions; but since they were so similar (I think it was that both Sues were "the most beautiful woman Jack had ever seen"), they sort of started bleeding into one another. The Sues fought and the one with the more cohesive story (including SPaG!) won.

Tiger glanced at his watch. It was precisely midnight. “Happy new year!” he announced, smiling as he looked round at his fellow boys. “May it bring many victories!”

“To victories!” echoed Tim, Andy and Seb. They all raised their plastic cups and took a swig of lemonade. The solemn note was rather ruined when Tiger coughed: the lemonade had been a little fizzier than he’d expected.

“Time to change watch,” Tiger added. Seb groaned but got to his feet, working his way past the blankets to the exit of the en-suite bathroom.

A couple of minutes later, the three remaining boys were joined by Robin.

“Fancy a round of cards?” asked Andy.

“You’re only saying that because you always win!” said Tiger. “I think we should go over the plan again.”

There was a collective groan.

“What’s the signal?” Tiger asked.

“A red flag dangling from the ceiling,” said Robin. “Seb’ll stick it out as soon as he sees the girls.”

“And what are you each going to do?” said Tiger, pointing at Andy first.

“I’m the emergency backup,” announced Andy. “I get to stay where I am!”

Tiger nodded. “Tim?”

“I go and sit out and twiddle my thumbs to lure the girls in,” said Tim.

“Robin?”

“I sneak round the right line of blankets to ambush.”

“And I’ll take the other side,” Tiger concluded. “The door should be unlocked, so what happens when the girls come in?”

There was a pause. Tim filled the silence. “Seb shuts the door with his lever up there once two of them are in. Then Robin and Tiger launch their ambush.”

Tiger nodded. “Now, there’s a high probability that Holly will try and blast the door in, which means we need to work quickly to avoid being overwhelmed. Aim to – “ he made quotation marks with his fingers – “kill them more or less straight away. If we’ve lost no more than one – ideally, we shouldn’t lose any – by the time we’re done, we attack. We’ll outnumber them and we can beat them easily. If we don’t win, everyone except me attacks. Aim to take out as many as possible no matter what. If you could leave Holly to me, that would be great, but don’t worry if not. Got all that?”

“We got it the first time you said it,” said Andy. “This is the fifth at least!”

They all glared at each other. Tiger kept waiting.

Thanks!

Yeah, Derik does look pretty rough here. In part it's because this is a less comedic piece, and as such it's also the first opportunity I've had (or taken) to show how I've imagined him to be between missions, without anything to distract him: volatile, even hostile, and generally difficult to be around. Also, I figure his ability to keep a lid on it has deteriorated as he's adjusted to life in the PPC and the bizarre has become mundane. At first there was culture shock, adventure, a kender, near-constant adrenaline; now, not so much. He's cultivated active hobbies to make up for it—exercise, AHAIRQ, carousing with teammates—but now Thoth is asking him to do precisely the opposite of that. And doesn't seem to get why his distant, calculated approach is not helpful...

~Neshomeh lives for overly detailed psychological analysis of characters.

...Thoth may not be quite so helpful initially. You'll see. :-P

So! Leonidas himself strikes me more, as you said, Black/White. Mostly because he hasn't let the Hunt and the secrets of the Chapter overtake his personality and ideals, such as they are. He's stoic to a fault, and does his best to keep in mind that he, too, was once mortal. He holds onto his ideals of discipline and leading by example with a deathgrip, and has taken to heart the Lion's teachings--namely, being slow to anger and quick to action.
As for Sammy, he's definitely White/Red--outgoing and animated where Leo is grim and silent. He's friendly and up for almost anything, yet difficult to truly provoke. In Gunpla battles--the closest he's been to combat of any sort as of yet--he fights defensively at first and gradually shifts to a more offensive and hotblooded stance and attitude as he gets the measure of his opponent, until he puts them on the backfoot and presses the advantage home. It doesn't always work, of course, but he'd say that's no loss since it's Gunpla battle, not war, and he learns things even when he loses.

Well, I'd say the Angels are closer to Black/Blue with their focus on secrecy and their stratified knowledge and revelations as a Marine progresses further through the ranks. (Some may never reach the final layers of secrets or know the real motives behind the Hunt. Leonidas, as a Company Master, has served in the Deathwing and is thus a full member of the Inner Circle, however.) And Black as primary reflects their willingness to sacrifice their honor and even their lives as penance for the actions of their predecessors, the Fallen. Supreme Grand Master Azrael reflects in Legacy of Caliban that should their worst fears be realized and the Dark Angels' secrets are exposed, they will not fire a single shot in self-defense against the Imperium.
At the same time, there's an argument, made by Master of Sanctity Sapphon, I think, that the Chapter must survive at all costs, on the grounds that many more innocents will die without the Dark Angels to defend them. Considering the clout of the Unforgiven Chapters as a whole, he's not just bragging. And I think the High Lords and the Inquisition appear to recognize this as well, which is why they accept the Dark Angels' zealotry and outstanding battle record as an excuse for their isolationist and questionable (at times) actions.

Wow, yeah, this kind of scene looks like it was tough to write. Very introspective and subtle; I'm not sure I even could have managed it! You guys did a good job, though. It's a little too abstract for me to really go int detail about why it feels so real, but it very definitely does have the right feeling about it. The visualization of Derik's feelings through Thoth's sensations of them was interesting, and felt appropriateyl complex and shifting. I'm a bit saddened by Derik's mental health state being a bit worse than I though up until now, but I'm glad he's a got a meditation teacher to help him through it.

One specific thing I like is the contrast between the first two scenes and the third. When we're inside Thoth's mind, his emotions and thoughts are stated plainly, showing his straightforward and calculating way of thinking. Then the last scene is largely from Tom's perspective, and we see how inscrutable and closed Thoth is to the outside observer.

—doctorlit, reading things